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YOUR BALANCE
does Clemson basketball do more with less?
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does Clemson basketball do more with less?


May 17, 2019, 2:28 PM

https://www.reddit.com/r/CollegeBasketball/comments/bps81q/acc_teams_average_recruiting_class_from_247_vs/


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Re: does Clemson basketball do more with less?


May 17, 2019, 2:42 PM

Unfortunately, I don't see how that has been accomplished recently.

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of course they have. Mid Pack in the ACC is well


May 17, 2019, 2:49 PM

above where we should be based on the recruiting and support level. I think what people want is to be in the mid level upper tier of the ACC which we're nipping at heels of but probably won't ever get there consistently. The only way to get to that level is to get that level coach. Which costs alot of money and requires alot of extra support.It require a pitino hire or a pearl like hire or a hire that we all probably wouldn't be comfortable with so..just stick with Brad and hope for a good recruit or two.

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I'm calling bovine fecal matter on that...


May 17, 2019, 3:18 PM

..."stick with Brad and HOPE for a good recruit or two."?? you must have bumped your head real hard when you were a very young child...

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I've been saying this for a while. We absolutely do


May 17, 2019, 3:35 PM

more with less, but the Brownell bashers refuse to acknowledge this.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Brownell isn't doing anything that any other Clemson coach


May 17, 2019, 4:36 PM

has done, given all previous arguments for his "success". But ultimately, even having dome more with less is still leaving Clemson out of the tournament 80% per decade. To me, that's not a measure of progress or success. Basketball is a sport where you do not have to wait for 3 or 4 recruiting classes to make progress. So, whether OP left the cupboard bare or not, Brownell should have been able to build a tournament team prior to his 8th season. You can't give OP guff for having left the cupboard bare but give Brownell credit for the 2010 tournament team because that's what OP left for Brownell...

Has Brownell done more with less? My answer is no...

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Re: Brownell isn't doing anything that any other Clemson coach


May 17, 2019, 4:59 PM

Well, OP had "better" recruiting classes but 0 tourney wins, with Brownell having "worse" recruiting classes and a few tournament wins.

So there's that for the "more with less" argument.

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Brownell is responsible for those "worse" recruiting classes


May 20, 2019, 10:15 AM

as well as all of the transfers out of those classes... with that in mind, I give Brownell credit for the two tournament wins, but building rosters through the transfer market is so much like attorneys who chase ambulances; they're both waiting for something bad or negative to happen to someone to step in and prey on their vulnerabilities... (i know, that is a very strong analogy in hyperbole, but the execution of the plan is very much spot on)

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Re: Brownell is responsible for those "worse" recruiting classes


May 21, 2019, 5:56 AM

Tell that to Texas Tech who took all their transfers to a Final Four. This is just one more adjustment within the framework of the system.

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that analogy misses the mark, primarily because the teams


May 21, 2019, 5:05 PM

regularly making the tournament are recruiting 4 year players. you can build a team chasing the ambulances through the transfer portal, but that won't build a program until you consistently get 2 and 3 year players as transfers, i.e., for example, knowing that you are recruiting 2019 enrolles to actually enroll in 2020, but recruiting really doesn't work that way. Transfers will always primarily be stop gap and emergency takes...

we've taken transfers all through Brownell's tenure, that has only resulted in one NCAA tournament invite in 9 seasons... and yes, Brownell has had two tournament teams, but that first team was what he inherited and was led by all of those veteran holdovers...

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Re: Brownell isn't doing anything that any other Clemson coach


May 17, 2019, 6:40 PM [ in reply to Brownell isn't doing anything that any other Clemson coach ]

Agree.

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Class of ‘71. Went through “rat season” and glad I did.


I've been saying to same thing too...


May 20, 2019, 11:43 AM [ in reply to I've been saying this for a while. We absolutely do ]

Say what you want about Brownell, but the guy CAN coach.

Don't give me this nonsense about his record of games decided by XX amount of points or less. The fact is, given our talent level we shouldn't even be in 75% of games to begin with give our talent acquisition vs everyone else.

If you want to bash recruiting, however, I'm on the front line with you. This has been the MOST glaring weakness.


The Brad and the AD needs to:

1) Improve facilities. CHECK!

2) Add budget for improved support staff/recruiting. Partial check (they added 1 position, but need to add another).

3) BB really needs to hit a home run with the next hire to replace Smith's position.

4) Increase Budget for recruiting.

3) DR needs to hold BB's feet to the fire when it comes to recruiting.


When we start getting #3-4 ranked classes year in and year out,....or, we get a #1 class (like Bennett did) and get lucky where all stay for 4 years, then you're going see us in the NCAA tournament each year, and make a deep run.

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Re: I've been saying this for a while. We absolutely do


May 21, 2019, 9:37 PM [ in reply to I've been saying this for a while. We absolutely do ]

B.B. has not improved the program since his arrival. I judge a coach by his improving the program.

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Re: does Clemson basketball do more with less?


May 17, 2019, 3:44 PM

I have to say that this is where *coaching* comes into play. This is where BB is earning every hard-fought dollar of his contract... and why he is a great coach for clemson.

Clemson is a hard sell for recruits. It has gotten better in the past 2 years but kids just do not want to play in front of empty grey seats. We (collectively) don't support it (see our own football players in the opposing colors). That being said, being mid-pack is exceeding where we should be. I know a lot of folks want more but they are just year-end record analysis. I go to the November & NIT games, so I turn out except for those UNC/Duke games because I am priced out most of the time. You got to support the team beyond just 3-5 game a year.

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Re: does Clemson basketball do more with less?


May 17, 2019, 3:51 PM

He is a a terrible recruiter and does alright with transfers and what not. This was Brownell's 3 good years. Had the sweet 16 year which was nice, but the results the year before were atrocious (6 wins with arguably his most talented team). Then this year where the team failed time and time again when giving opportunity. Higher and young up and comer. Heck, higher a female coach, couldn't hurt to try. I'd rather fall flat on my face trying something new than continue with the current dull, unexciting program we have now.

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Awful recruiters wouldn’t have signed two four star top 100 prospects this year


May 17, 2019, 7:17 PM

who were wanted by teams with much better history and support than Clemson has.

Oh, and today he signed a transfer player who was a five star coming out of high school a year ago. That still counts as recruiting.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: does Clemson basketball do more with less?


May 19, 2019, 6:57 AM [ in reply to Re: does Clemson basketball do more with less? ]

Yes let’s hire a female and see how many guys want to go that route. The low hanging fruit around here amazes me constantly.

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Higher??***


May 20, 2019, 11:18 AM [ in reply to Re: does Clemson basketball do more with less? ]



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We certainly don't do less with more***


May 17, 2019, 4:16 PM



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Re: We certainly don't do less with more***


May 17, 2019, 6:31 PM

That’s for sure.

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Re: does Clemson basketball do more with less?


May 17, 2019, 4:33 PM

FWIW four of our starters weren't included in our recruiting rankings due to being transfers, so that chart doesn't show the complete story. Furthermore, every player from the 2015 and 2016 classes has transferred. Also I'm not sure that one could say that we did more with less last year when we returned 4 starters from a sweet 16 team and couldn't get out of the second round in the NIT.

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Brad Brownell: more losses than any other coach in school history.


We lost Donte and Gabe off last years team, Sims was only a


May 17, 2019, 4:38 PM

fill in starter due to injury

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Re: We lost Donte and Gabe off last years team, Sims was only a


May 17, 2019, 4:46 PM

Donte didn't play for most of the ACC season. We still made it to the sweet 16 starting Simms/Skara.

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Brad Brownell: more losses than any other coach in school history.


We were 16 and 3 with DG and finished the regular season


May 17, 2019, 4:59 PM

on a 6 and 5 run, we'll just have to agree to disagree about who was the bigger contributor

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Re: We were 16 and 3 with DG and finished the regular season


May 17, 2019, 6:12 PM

All what I'm saying is that Donte didn't play a single minute in the tournament wins over New Mexico or Auburn.

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Brad Brownell: more losses than any other coach in school history.


Re: does Clemson basketball do more with less?


May 17, 2019, 6:38 PM

Well for this year with all of the returning veterans you would have to say we had more. Based on the previous year we achieved less. So less with more.

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Class of ‘71. Went through “rat season” and glad I did.


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