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Webmaster [∞]
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Front Page Story: Final thoughts
Sep 23, 2012, 11:16 AM
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Final thoughts
Final thoughts on Clemson's 49-37 loss to Florida St. Saturday night in Tallahassee, a night that saw the offense do enough to win. Full Story » |
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Orange Blooded [3768]
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Couldn't agree more about Travis Blanks.
Sep 23, 2012, 11:34 AM
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He's been one of the very few bright spots on our defense this season.
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Legend [15526]
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Re: Front Page Story: Final thoughts
Sep 23, 2012, 11:48 AM
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I don't disagree with any of your comments, but what we saw last night should surprise no one. Our Defense has played pretty poorly at times the entire year and in several games last year. I did expect BV's influence would have resulted in more immediate results, though. I agree that our LB play has been poor, but the DL isn't dominating, either. But going into the season nobody thought they would be. That said, I do not think we have the best athletes on the field, and I would take a ball hawk with great speed like Steward and Townsend over what we are seeing now. Anthony is good, but he can't do it alone. The OL is better than most thought it would be, and 37 points should win the game. All that said, when # 4 meets # 10, # 4 should win most of the time, and as poorly as we played, we still had our chances to put it away. It was defensive failures that wreaked havoc on us again.
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110%er [6937]
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Re:When I see Christian running, at about 60% of full
Sep 23, 2012, 12:27 PM
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speed towards the ball carrier, then someone else would be taking his place.
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CU Guru [1899]
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Re:When I see Christian running, at about 60% of full
Sep 23, 2012, 6:02 PM
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just out of curiosity, since I don't know the play you're talking about...I have seen guys so fast, they just blow by the ball carrier, because they don't have time to adjust to his speed. I see that all the time in NFL games. Thoughts?
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Legend [15526]
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Re:When I see Christian running, at about 60% of full
Sep 23, 2012, 8:36 PM
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Not to call anybody out, but I think Anthony has played up to expectations, but we could be much better at the other 2 spots. I am to the point that I would take the speed and aggression of Lateek Townsend and Tony Steward in favor of the other 2. JMO, but our LB's have been poor for too long. The defense needs a strong dose of attacking the offense and some major tackling drills for when they get to the ball.
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Enthusiast [131]
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Re: Front Page Story: Final thoughts
Sep 23, 2012, 11:54 AM
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I totally agree with David Hood about changing the personnel in our defense. We need to change personnel. Blanks - safety, Shuey - mid lb , Stephone / Lateek olb, Cortez / Robinson corner, Reader/ Watkins dl. Hall and Meeks- BENCH. I mean seriously, these changes couldn't make us worse than we are now.
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Athletic Dir [864]
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Blanks is going to be really good
Sep 23, 2012, 11:59 AM
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He has a great work ethic. I think the defensive personnel aren't on the same page. Players are still looking so confused. Up to Dabo to get this straightened out.
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Commissioner [942]
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Re: Blanks is going to be really good
Sep 23, 2012, 12:22 PM
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When you simply don't have the talent on the field, can you just "straighten it out?"
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CU Guru [1163]
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100% agreement on Blanks
Sep 23, 2012, 12:06 PM
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Kid may not always know where to be... but wherever he is, he is there to disrupt. (And can cover also) The rest? Pffft.
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Commissioner [942]
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Re: 100% agreement on Blanks
Sep 23, 2012, 12:26 PM
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Agreed. Time to put some butts on the bench and give the younger dogs a shot. And, my god, someone at least objectively review our S&C program.
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Orange Blooded [2519]
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What's the downsiide of new def players? allowing points?***
Sep 23, 2012, 12:24 PM
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CU Guru [1346]
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Re: What's the downsiide of new def players? allowing points?***
Sep 23, 2012, 3:08 PM
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I agree and we have some games coming up where we can take some serious risks on defense and still pull out a win. The idea is to get as good as you can for VT and SC isn't it?
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Legend [16330]
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Trainer [47]
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Re: Front Page Story: Final thoughts
Sep 23, 2012, 12:49 PM
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Blanks, Willard and Vic Beasley have been the best players so far on Defense, Meeks is up and down too much and Hall and Brewer in my opinion have sucked! So yeah let the players you are thinking about redshirting play they can't tackle or cover any worse than the ones on the field now.
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Hall of Famer [24764]
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Nothing to lose from what I've seen. Go man-to-man and
Sep 23, 2012, 12:58 PM
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start stunting and blitzing. The zone is NOT 'in the zone'. +1.
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CU Guru [1346]
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Re: Front Page Story: Final thoughts
Sep 23, 2012, 3:10 PM
[ in reply to Re: Front Page Story: Final thoughts ] |
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It may be an overreaction on my part, but I find it hard to believe a GOOD freshman recruit out of high school could be any worse at tackling. We don't even look like the top of the crop for high school these days. We've got hands, arms, and half our bodies on guys and they stand up and run as if it's nothing.
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CU Guru [1346]
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Re: Front Page Story: Final thoughts
Sep 23, 2012, 3:15 PM
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Even though there is some experience in our D, they still look to have made only a small amount of progress over last year. I have a hunch from Venables' press conference that he is planning on putting the hammer down. He slipped and suggested it may be time to shake up who plays, but he probably has enough class to not air all of that out in a Q&A session. Especially after such a bad defensive showing - he doesn't want to show his emotions in public. The way Swinney avoided any strong criticism of the defense makes me think his head may be in the same place. So he wouldn't likely override Venables.
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Orange Blooded [2760]
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Stewart
Sep 23, 2012, 4:19 PM
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I've been preaching how bad our defense is all year so I won't go into that. But what the heck are DS and BV doing with Tony? BV says he hasn't done power cleans in a year and yet we WASTE his second year on Special Teams? We have TWO seniors in front of him and now we have wasted a tremendous talent this year by putting him in a few snap occassionally. If a kid can't play 100 snaps MINIMUM at his position (I don't count SP plays), he should redshirt. We made the same mistakes last year with several players and again this year with some talented young men (Brooks is another; and he NEEDED to redshirt to add bulk). I truly don't see why Dabo does not value the redshirt like most do. But since he is down to two years after 2012, PLAY him. Good Lord, we need somebody, anybody, to make some plays on defense.
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CU Guru [1038]
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Thank you for finally saying it bluntly
Sep 23, 2012, 4:24 PM
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the defense sucks!!! They dont do anything well. Tackle, stop the run, pass rush, pass coverage, nothing!
And Morris is right. His play calling for the last half of the third and beginning of fourth quarter sucked. He got away from being balanced and started just passing it every down even up 14 points. Those 4 three and outs in a row killed us and gave FSU all the momentum. But the offense played their guts out and maybe only deserve maybe 10% of the credit, the defense deserves the other 90%.
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Rock Defender [53]
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More like
Sep 24, 2012, 3:09 PM
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Blame Percentages: Defense:75% Special Teams: 10% Offense: 5%
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Legend [16330]
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this comments hit the nail on the head
Sep 23, 2012, 4:26 PM
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However, you can’t expect to go on the road against a talented defense like Florida St. has and expect to score on every possession. In fact, if you put up 37 points and over 400 yards of offense, you should win the game.
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Orange Blooded [4019]
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Well said***
Sep 23, 2012, 5:14 PM
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CU Guru [1729]
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CU's D-talent & experience isn't THAT bad. Underperforming.
Sep 23, 2012, 6:29 PM
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Good summary from B-Meist.
FSU's O, D & ST are really good so it's not like Clemson lost to some huge underdog. However, after watching Clemson play 4 games this season, it's apparent that the O is really good and the D is really bad. Clemson may not have Top 5 defensive player-talent & experience on the roster, but the defense has an enviable amount of talent & experience, and (IMHO) is seriously underperforming its player-talent.
Venables reportedly said that the D talent at Clemson is comparable/faster than what he had at Oklahoma. http://www.tigernet.com/view/story.do?id=10859
The recruiting rankings for the Clemson-FSU depth charts show a pretty talented group of CU players (but a more talented group of FSU players). http://www.shakinthesouthland.com/2012/9/20/3355392/clemson-florida-state-2012-depth-chart-comparison
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CU Guru [1639]
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Warrior
Sep 23, 2012, 7:03 PM
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If you want to see what a football player should be, Look at Boyd. He just may be the toughest dude on the team. He looked like he had been in a war but never stopped leading. He is just not a run threat like FSU's QB.
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CU Guru [1729]
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These stats show a new, good DC can get instant improvement.
Sep 23, 2012, 7:23 PM
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Many people are making the excuse that Brent Venables is working with weak player-talent and that he needs time to implement his system (even though it's pretty similar to Steele's system). But over the last few years, as a Clemson fan, I've tracked the impact that Clemson DCs (Koennign, Steele, & Venables) have brought to Clemson, and their pre/post Clemson teams. It would be interesting to see a broader sampling of data for more DCs around the country, but the following data pretty clearly shows that a good or bad DC can have an instant good or bad impact on their new teams (of course with players that they didn't recruit). For example, former Clemson DC, Vic Koenning had an immediate and significantly positive impact wherever he went (Clemson, K-State, Illinois, & UNC). Steele had a significantly negative impact at Alabama & Clemson. It really worries me that Venables isn't having a positive impact on Clemson's defensive performance.
Clemson: Venables: 2012: Total D: #93. Scoring D: #68 (after 1st 4 games, Aub, Ball St. Furm, FSU.) Steele 2011: Total D: #62. Scoring D: #81. Steele 2010: Total D: #62. Scoring D: #47. Steele 2009: Total D: #20. Scoring D: #25. Koenning 2008: Total D: #18. Scoring D: #13. Koenning 2007: Total D: #9.. Scoring D: #10. Koenning 2006: Total D: #13. Scoring D: #16. Koenning 2005: Total D: #20. Scoring D: #11. Lovett 2004: Total D: #26. Scoring D: #29
Alabama: Post-Steele 2008: Total D: #3. Scoring D: #7. Steele 2007:........ Total D: #31. Scoring D: #27. Steele 2006:……… Total D: #23. Scoring D: #31. Pre-Steele 2005:.. Total D: #2. Scoring D: #1.
UNC: 2012 Koenning: Total D: #27. Scoring D: #35 (after 1st 4 games: Elon, WF, Louisville, ECU). 2011 pre-Koenning: Total D: #49. Scoring D: #56.
Illinois: 2010 Koenning: Total D: #38. Scoring D: #67 2010 Koenning: Total D: #20. Scoring D: #21. (After 1st 5 games: Mizzou, OSU, PSU, NIU, & S. Ill.) 2009 pre-Koenning: Total D: #91. Scoring D: #96.
Kansas State: 2010 post-Koenning: Total D: #82. Scoring D: #66. 2009 Koenning: Total D: #39. Scoring D: #46. 2008 pre-Koenning: Total D: #86. Scoring D: #117.
Note that I didn't try to cherry-pick any data. I compiled most of this in years past and saved it to a file. Hence the 2010 5-game checkpoint of Koenning at Illinois just happened to be something I checked back then.
Also note that the talent Venables inherited is (at least from a recruiting rankings standpont) pretty darned good.
Clemson- FSU depth chart recruiting rankings: http://www.shakinthesouthland.com/2012/9/20/3355392/clemson-florida-state-2012-depth-chart-comparison
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CU Guru [1729]
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I made a mistake on Steele 2010-11 data. Revised data...
Sep 24, 2012, 3:00 PM
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Sorry. It should look like this:
Clemson: Lovett 2004: Total D: #26. Scoring D: #29 Koenning 2005: Total D: #20. Scoring D: #11. Koenning 2006: Total D: #13. Scoring D: #16. Koenning 2007: Total D: #9.. Scoring D: #10. Koenning 2008: Total D: #18. Scoring D: #13. Steele 2009: Total D: #20. Scoring D: #25. Steele 2010: Total D: #19. Scoring D: #13. Steele 2011: Total D: #71. Scoring D: #81. Venables: 2012: Total D: #93. Scoring D: #68 (after 1st 4 games, Aub, Ball St. Furm, FSU.)
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