|
Replies: 24
| visibility 611
|
CU Medallion [56005]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 31617
Joined: 8/27/02
|
Can we please stop with the what aboutism?
Jan 7, 2021, 1:30 PM
|
|
We should be able to talk about what happened yesterday (or any other topic really) and discuss what was right and what was wrong without relitigating some similar scenario where the roles were reversed. It happens every single time something like this happens, when there's something so blatantly wrong and indefensible, and people try to turn it around. It's such a routine at this point and I can't decide if it's more sad, boring, or lazy. We need a referee whistle or we should be able to throw a flag on a post: "Whataboutism, defense, ten downvote penalty."
The next time someone one your side of the aisle does something ###### up, just say it's ###### up and leave it at that. Don't pull this, "Yeah but what about [time] when [person] did [thing]???" bull####.
|
|
|
|
 |
All-In [46801]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 30710
Joined: 8/11/15
|
You must be new here***
Jan 7, 2021, 1:31 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [79400]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 63266
Joined: 10/30/05
|
Maybe once the mind blowing hypocrisy stops we can
Jan 7, 2021, 1:33 PM
|
|
Until then, I will continue to be amazed at the sheer lack of self awareness on display in this country. It's like people don't even remember what they said 4 months ago. And I know it goes both ways, but my god this has been eye opening. The same people who were telling us white supremacists were behind the BLM/Antifa riots are now mocking those who say Antifa were behind yesterdays little ordeal. The same people who told us protests were supposed to make people uncomfortable are now really uncomfortable and don't like it anymore. It goes on and on.
People in this country are living on at least 3 different planets right now, possibly 4.
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [56005]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 31617
Joined: 8/27/02
|
Jon Stewart made a career out of that for like 15 years.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:13 PM
|
|
Every episode of the Daily Show was like, "Here's what Senator blah said today and here's them saying the exact opposite last month/last year/ten years ago." That's entertaining, but it's empty calories.
People also like to take the fringiest political hack and then pretend that that person represents half of the country. I'm sure there were people who said white supremacists covertly infiltrated BLM or Antifa, but that's not what most liberals actually believe. Nobody should act like the people who stormed the Capitol yesterday were typical, mainstream Republicans.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [9647]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 11403
Joined: 9/10/99
|
You have just described what is wrong with the entire
Jan 7, 2021, 1:36 PM
|
|
country...
No one on either side is willing to say "You know what - we've all done it, now let's get past that and talk about things."
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2763]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1981
Joined: 8/23/12
|
I completely agree with you, but good freaking luck.
Jan 7, 2021, 1:44 PM
|
|
The extreme right and left on here both love hiding behind strawman and Tu Quoque fallacies.
Statement: "Pro-Trump extremists storm the US Capitol, interrupting the session to confirm Joe Biden as President."
Response: "BUT LOOK AT ANTIFA AND BLM OVER THE SUMMER!"
This is an argumentative fallacy that does not address the anarchist action of storming a US government building. You're either ok with that or you're not. Tossing these fallacies about kind of implies the former.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [97676]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 64819
Joined: 7/13/02
|
Every single time something like this happens?
Jan 7, 2021, 1:44 PM
|
|
Like what? Storming the Capital building? Ok, so that was August 24, 1814. Someone took a selfie....
here it is....
And all it took was an Army and the world's strongest navy, and an all out war, that waged for a few years before they got inside the Capitol.
This took a week of social media trolling, and a few thousand rednecks.
#progress
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [24455]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 13956
Joined: 7/3/01
|
If we are talking about that thing, and how we all got to
Jan 7, 2021, 1:45 PM
|
|
this point, I think you are 100% correct. However, if someone says it was the pubs fault, using a prior event to show that this is not the case is a legit response. The discussion/argument can go from there, but that is not whataboutism. IE, a person can't claim that the previous 24 hours contains all one needs to know, and defend that by saying a reference to history is whataboutism.
That might not be what you were referring to, and whataboutism has happened in this case.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [42023]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 38173
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Re: Can we please stop with the what aboutism?
Jan 7, 2021, 2:00 PM
|
|
Yep. We've been sitting here having to rehash the summer unrest, which has absolutely nothing, 0 percent, to do with what happened yesterday.
And it's been mostly people saying, "But why didn't you denounce that back then?!" to those who actually, you know, did do that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [93612]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95387
Joined: 12/25/09
|
Did you condemn the antifa/blm riots?
Jan 7, 2021, 2:09 PM
|
|
If you didn't openly condemn antifa/blm riots I'm all in with you. If you defended them or remained silent rather than speaking out you're part of the problem.
I'm not accusing you of anything, just pointing to a universal truth.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [42023]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 38173
Joined: 11/30/98
|
He did multiple times.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:11 PM
|
|
No one here supported any of the violence or destruction that happened over the summer. Stop the whataboutism. It's irrelevant. When y'all do it, it kinda makes it look like you're defending yesterday.
This is one issue where we should all be in agreement. That yesterday was wrong. I know you feel that way, but don't delve into this whataboutism, and for the love of sweet Jesus, 88, don't push Antifa conspiracies from yesterday.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [93612]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95387
Joined: 12/25/09
|
The only thing I'm pushing is some consistence.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:36 PM
|
|
I plainly spoke against the violence with no consideration to who may have been involved. If the OP spoke out against antifa violence then he is insulted from any form of attack from anyone claiming the DC episode was justified.
However, I remember most of the left either blaming Trump for antifa/blm violence or just remaining silent day after day, week after week for months. I didn't keep a list and if I had one I wouldn't publish it. I'm not made that way.
If the arrows I shoot do not hit you then you should appreciated what I'm saying more and more each day. If you're not one of those who claimed the riots, looting and burning of private and public property were 'mostly peaceful protest,' then you really have no reason to defend them now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [42023]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 38173
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Re: The only thing I'm pushing is some consistence.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:41 PM
|
|
But those all of you are calling for were consistent. We also have to recognize that with what happened yesterday, it was not comparable to this summer. Thus, the comparisons shouldn't be drawn, and the demands of consistency are directed at the wrong people.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [93612]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95387
Joined: 12/25/09
|
Over two billion in damage was done in DC yesteday?
Jan 7, 2021, 3:01 PM
|
|
I'm not getting how either is better or worse than the other. Imo, it take some fine hair splitting to say otherwise. Was it the damage to private or public property which made the DC riot worse?
Was it human death? Only one person died yesterday. She was attempting to enter a federal building without authority or permission to do so. I have not considered other circumstances. I don't actually compare that to the ex Sheriff in St Louis who was gunned down by antifa/blm while standing in front of a private business trying to protect a friend's property. I saw him bleed out on the sidewalk.
We should join in prayer that all violence should be ended from both sides rather than splitting hairs about who to look down upon.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [42023]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 38173
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Y'all are fallaciously focusing on material issues here.
Jan 7, 2021, 3:06 PM
|
|
And since you are one of many posters who has stated this argument, it can only be assumed y'all are getting marching orders from right-wing media for talking points.
The more abstract damage is the issue with what happened yesterday:
-A mob assault on our legislative branch to overturn an election, seize control of government, and possibly commit worse atrocities once control is established. All the while encouraged by the sitting president who wants to remain in power, so he needed this last gasp effort.
-Some police who were likely complicit and in on the ordeal, meaning this was a somewhat well organized attempt to seize that control.
-A nation watching on live TV and realizing that maybe our institutions aren't as safe as we thought they were.
That's more damaging than $10 billion worth of Starbucks destroyed.
Aren't we all against the violence? But y'all have been scrambling all day to compare it to last year and the responses of people who aren't even on this board. Why not just focus on this issue?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [93612]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95387
Joined: 12/25/09
|
Is hyperbolate a word?
Jan 7, 2021, 3:53 PM
|
|
It should be, I think you hyperbolated when you said the point of the riot was to overturn an election. How you determined that anyone thought they could overturn an election with a riot is beyond any form of reason.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [42023]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 38173
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Wut wut...
Jan 7, 2021, 3:58 PM
|
|
They said the reason they were there was to stop the counting of the EC votes, Trump encouraged them to descend on the Capitol to stop it, and they were out there with nooses, restraints for hostages, civil war shirts, and calling for a revolution.
You've got be kidding, 88. Why else do you think they were there?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2763]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1981
Joined: 8/23/12
|
You are a PERFECT example of what he's talking about.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:19 PM
[ in reply to Did you condemn the antifa/blm riots? ] |
|
One argumentative fallacy after another. And to humor you, yes, we did condemn those riots. Brazen destruction is never ok; a lot of livelihoods were negatively impacted.
But storming the US Capitol building is condemnable as well, isn't it? So enough with your Tu Quoque nonsense and answer the question: do you support or condemn yesterday's insurrectionists? Because, you know, that happened YESTERDAY and not months ago, and it interrupted the confirmation of a United States Presidential election.
Are you going to defend them or remain silent? Or will you stand against anarchy? Make your choice.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [93612]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95387
Joined: 12/25/09
|
If only I had condemned the violence in DC yesterday as it..
Jan 7, 2021, 2:30 PM
|
|
was happening. Oh for a time machine to make you look like a blithering fool.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2763]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1981
Joined: 8/23/12
|
I never said you didn't; I simply didn't know that you had.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:49 PM
|
|
I don't think that makes me a "blithering fool". And I'm glad to hear you don't support yesterday's insurrectionists that the President incited and loves. You're just gonna have to forgive me for not seeing and memorizing every post on this board, especially not during an extremely high-activity period like yesterday afternoon and evening.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [42023]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 38173
Joined: 11/30/98
|
To be fair.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:39 PM
[ in reply to You are a PERFECT example of what he's talking about. ] |
|
88 did immediately denounce the actions at the Capitol yesterday (it all got lost in the posts, but he did it).
Now, I don't like his whataboutism or insinuation that it was an Antifa conspiracy, but he has remained on message against forms of violence and destruction.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2763]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1981
Joined: 8/23/12
|
Good on him, and I acknowledge that.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:52 PM
|
|
Thanks for pointing it out. Like I said above, I never said he didn't. I just wanted to hear if any of the far-right members of this board condemned the actions, because not all of them do.
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [56005]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 31617
Joined: 8/27/02
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [93612]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 95387
Joined: 12/25/09
|
I mean no attack on you.
Jan 7, 2021, 2:39 PM
|
|
I missed this morning because I stayed up late trying to count to infinity. You shouldn't take anything in my previous post as an attack for surely I did not intend it as one. I apologize for not reviewing more of the board and coming to realize you condemned antifa/blm violence this morning.
How did you address it over the last 7-8 months, I don't remember.
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [65983]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 24689
Joined: 6/12/14
|
It was ###### up
Jan 7, 2021, 2:41 PM
|
|
WHat about the national debt, huh ?
Love you bby 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Replies: 24
| visibility 611
|
|
|
50
