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Webmaster [∞]
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Purnell Does Not Agree With Ogelsby Decision to Turn Pro
May 27, 2009, 5:03 PM
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Orange Blooded [2034]
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Gotta love OP.***
May 27, 2009, 5:06 PM
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CU Medallion [51550]
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Who would? It's a bad move on TO's part.
May 27, 2009, 5:21 PM
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Not for what he brought to the table in terms of basketball but the fact that he was getting a free education.
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Orange Blooded [3599]
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If he can make as much as $500,000 a year, per the article,
May 27, 2009, 5:35 PM
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then I doubt the cost of education is of much consequence to him.
As good as he is, I doubt he'd ever see the NBA, where he'd see more money. That limits his options to overseas ball.
If the guy can go overseas and make that kind of money for a few years, he'll be way ahead of any of the rest of us at his age from an income standpoint.
Face it...the guy has a gift that can earn him a living during a limited window of time. Foregoing those two years may cost him $1 million according to the article.
If he's cut in 4-5 years, he's banked some money and can return for his degree, and then enter "the real world" with some nice change in the bank. Heck, he has plenty of time for that.
Can't blame him for leaving.
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Orange Blooded [2775]
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As much as I hate to see TO go...
May 27, 2009, 5:48 PM
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Rowdy is right on. TO impresses me as the type to eventually finish his degree but like Rowdy said--it is likely a narrow window of time for him to make his money. A few million can still go a long way---particularly in Norway or wherever without the IRS dipping in the till. Good luck TO--we'll miss you man!
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Starter [385]
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The IRS maybe...but most European countries take a LOT
May 27, 2009, 8:45 PM
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more in taxes than we do. You have to pay for all of that free stuff the gov't gives you.
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Legend [18133]
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Generally, they take it as a sales tax, though. Over there,
May 28, 2009, 7:47 AM
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it's not uncommon to pay up to 100% on certain consumer goods. Buy a $100 DVD player, for example, and it may actually cost you $200.
I wish the US would do away with income tax and go to a federal sales tax here. It's the most equitable tax there is. Those who the earn the most spend the most and can more easily afford to pay the tax.
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110%er [5436]
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Re: Generally, they take it as a sales tax, though. Over there,
May 28, 2009, 8:42 AM
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My retired parents says HELLO You want to pay as much as 100% in sales tax ???? That's crazy
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Fan [52]
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Re: Generally, they take it as a sales tax, though. Over there,
May 28, 2009, 12:25 PM
[ in reply to Generally, they take it as a sales tax, though. Over there, ] |
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It really isn't very equitable. When you consider that the rich only spend 40% or 50% of their income and the poor spend 100% of their income.
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Standout [313]
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Re: Generally, they take it as a sales tax, though. Over there,
May 28, 2009, 5:53 PM
[ in reply to Generally, they take it as a sales tax, though. Over there, ] |
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Norway's Sales Tax or as they call it, a value added tax (VAT), is 24%. They also have income taxes (combined municipal and national), for people earning more than $8k/year ranging from 28% to 47.5% depending on income and marital status. They do receive more government services for all those taxes (health care, general welfare, housing, etc.), but I won't get into that debate.
While there are probably many other issues with switching completely to a national sales tax, the two main problems that I have are this,
1. People who are retired or who are about to retire have spent their entire lives paying income tax. Their income tax payments have allowed the government to avoid the need to charge sales tax. They planned their retirements based on the idea that they wouldn't be paying any more taxes beyond the 5-10% sales tax. If we switched over to a national sales tax, that generation would end up paying far more taxes over the course of their lives than their parents or their children.
2. A sales tax is regressive. Since lower income individuals spend more of their income, the poor would pay a much higher percentage of their income in sales tax than the rich would.
3. A sales tax cannot be adjusted easily. Sales taxes are a blunt weapon. You can change the percentage just a little here and there, but the political battle would be easily focused on that one issue.
4. A higher sales tax would reduce consumption. That is, if people see cost at the point of sale, they are more likely to simply reduce their consumption to reduce their overall tax. While I think that people should probably save more money by consuming less, I don't think that now is the time to give our economy a 25% increase in sticker shock.
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110%er [7714]
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if that's the case, how come more college players dont
May 27, 2009, 8:05 PM
[ in reply to If he can make as much as $500,000 a year, per the article, ] |
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go this route? And ignore the dual citizenship clause. Im doubting Norway has big time pro basketball.
Sorry, I cant see how this is good. Even our coach says so. Who are you to doubt a man who does this for a living?
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110%er [9174]
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Nice Counter Point***
May 27, 2009, 9:23 PM
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CU Guru [1118]
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Who knows??
May 27, 2009, 11:26 PM
[ in reply to if that's the case, how come more college players dont ] |
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Maybe some don't want to live overseas, maybe some still dream of the NBA, even if their chances of making there are small, or maybe some other reasons?
When it comes to athletes leaving early, I can never blame any of them if there is a real chance of them making a lot of money, whether that be $100k or $10M. Granted, many of them may lose out on the potential to make those numbers higher by returning to college for a year or two... but they're still skyrocketing into very nice levels of income that most people only dream of reaching.
So what exactly do you not see good about a 21-or-so year-old making hundreds of thousands of dollars playing a game, especially considering he probably doesn't have the potential to make the NBA??
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Orange Blooded [4757]
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Re: if that's the case, how come more college players dont
May 28, 2009, 7:26 AM
[ in reply to if that's the case, how come more college players dont ] |
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The dual citizenship is important because it means he can play anywhere *in Europe* without counting against the American player cap (which most college players would count against). He's not limited to playing in Norway.
Not that I think it makes the decision any better or worse, I'm just saying his options aren't limited to one country.
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All-In [38514]
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Ignore the dual citizenship?
May 28, 2009, 7:32 AM
[ in reply to if that's the case, how come more college players dont ] |
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That's why most can't do this. They place limits on Americans on rosters, so because Norway lacks basketball talent this gives TO an advantage. He only has to be better than a handful of Norwegians.
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Rock Defender [53]
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and...
May 28, 2009, 8:36 PM
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...it does not specify that he has to play for Norway. Because he has a Norwegian passport, any European team can sign him without concern that he is one of two Americans that can play on the team.
The original poster to this part of the conversation should have read more carefully.
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Orange Blooded [3599]
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Well what would you expect Purnell to say?
May 28, 2009, 8:28 AM
[ in reply to if that's the case, how come more college players dont ] |
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Of course he is going to say it is a "bad decision" because he needs the kid on the roster next year. Have you ever heard ANY coach say that any kid leaving early is a "good decision"? Of course I'm going to doubt what Purnell says.
I bet if you asked Purnell if Oglesby would ever play in the NBA, he would say "If he works hard, stays all four years, and puts in the time, I think he can play in the NBA." Of course he is going to say that...that's what all coaches tell their players. That doesn't mean he will.
I can look at the facts of the situation...the dual citizenship, the foregone salary, TO's age, and the prospect of coming back to Clemson at 27-28 with some bankroll in hand heading to TTT with co-ed's in tow...and I know what I'd do.
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110%er [5382]
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Re: Purnell Does Not Agree With Ogelsby Decision to Turn Pro
May 27, 2009, 5:51 PM
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After all of the turmoil going on in the Tigers locker room the last 2 weeks of the season that culminated in a flagrant foul ejection, I'd say that Oglesby not even consulting his coach on such a matter proves to me that he was uncoachable & he had little regard for his teammates. I'm thinking mutual separation in this case. Losing potential and scoring can be offset by other players committed to defense and ball movement.
I have also been wondering on the fact that grades being posted recently had a factor in this sudden decision????
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CU Guru [1279]
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I had heard he was not that bad of a student***
May 27, 2009, 6:10 PM
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110%er [5436]
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Orange Blooded [4139]
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Nice parting shot from O.P.
May 27, 2009, 7:19 PM
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"helped us during the regular season and making it to the tournament". By omission - a nice shot about his tournamnet debacle. Subtle but sharp, O.P.!
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CU Guru [1535]
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I think you misread Purnell's comment.
May 27, 2009, 8:44 PM
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He's got too much class to be sticking it to players like that--subtly or not.
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Orange Blooded [4559]
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OP makes it clear he had nothing to do with this. Smart move***
May 27, 2009, 8:57 PM
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Fan [63]
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Re: Purnell Does Not Agree With Ogelsby Decision to Turn Pro
May 28, 2009, 9:17 AM
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Reguardless of the money, European bball isn't going anywhere. I really liked watching T.O. Shoot but that was really selfish to just drop the team like that. If you have a love for the game the money is not the 1st thing on your mind. If you can't find a way to work with your team its not going to matter where you go.
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Scout Team [158]
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Re: Purnell Does Not Agree With Ogelsby Decision to Turn Pro
May 29, 2009, 8:03 AM
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"If you can't find a way to work with your team its not going to matter where you go."
You've just described every star in the NBA. Thank you free-agency.
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Standout [331]
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Re: Purnell Does Not Agree With Ogelsby Decision to Turn Pro
May 28, 2009, 2:59 PM
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I'm a big OP fan but my feelings about players leaving early to turn pro has evolved over time. OP may not agree with it and we may not have any outside threats next year. We'll just have to wait and see.
However, I believe TO refers his opportunities to play professionally. I don't remember any specific references to the NBA. I personally believe a kid should turn pro anytime he can recoup enough money to finance his education once his playing career is over. And he should begin his career anytime he can turn pro and be assured of this.
The argument that he's getting a free education doesn't impress me any more. Although official practice time is limited, when you consider the other hours they put in to stay "comptetive", I wonder what that works out to as an hourly wage.
I don't think TO has future in the NBA so if a European team will pay him now, he should go while he is still in his prime as far as basketball earning capacity is concerned. If he could improve his stock as an NBA player that would be a different matter but I don't think that's the case here.
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1st Rounder [640]
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I don't agree with it either!***
May 28, 2009, 5:33 PM
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