Yea, it's pretty amazing those schools have dropped off the way they have. Wake Forest has fallen off the face of the earth as well, but they're a small school without much history when it comes to football. UVA is a 20,000+ size school and NC State is over 30,000. They're both located in strong states for recruiting talent. I know a lot of their talent gets poached by better schools *cough*us*cough* but they should still be able to field better teams than they have.