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Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty
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Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 3:21 PM

 
The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty

The penalty that former tight end Dwayne Allen drew for saluting in 2009 was mentioned this week during a meeting with the head of ACC officials. Why was the penalty called? What is the connection between the official who threw the flag and September 11? Full Story »


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Hopkins saluted this past year after torching FSU


Jul 24, 2013, 3:25 PM

No flag

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It still should not have been flagged


Jul 24, 2013, 3:27 PM

It was not taunting, or calling attention to himself. The fact that the official who threw the flag was a first responder on 9/11 has nothing to do with it.

2024 purple level member flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

"It is not part of a true culture to tame tigers any more than it is to make sheep ferocious."
--Henry David Thoreau


I know this isn't a popular opinion...


Jul 24, 2013, 3:32 PM

But it was the right call. It was a choreographed part of a touchdown celebration, and especially so being that he's a civilian who shouldn't be saluting anyway.

(For the record, I'm not saying it's not a silly flag, because it is... But the penalty was in line with what's in the rulebook.)

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Re: I know this isn't a popular opinion...


Jul 24, 2013, 3:41 PM

To call him a civilian is not 100% accurate. He was definitely out of uniform, but I believe he was an ROTC cadet at the time. I would say that calling the penalty shows poor judgement, not a lack of partiotism.

We can't know what was in the mind of the official. He may have thought that the player was saluting the fans, not the flat. He likely didn't know about Allen's military background, or ROTC participation and could have thought it inappropriate for a college football player to be saluting. He might have taken offense to something Allen said or did earlier in the game. Unless and until the official gives a full account while hooked up to a lie detector, we won't settle this and that aint happening.

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I think it has something to do with it


Jul 24, 2013, 3:32 PM [ in reply to It still should not have been flagged ]

But in the opposite way of how it turned out. I'm not a first responder, police officer, or in the military so I may be completely off-base in this line of thinking. But I would think that being a 9/11 first responnder, seeing someone salute (a gesture of respect) on military appreciation day would lead me to not throw the flag instead of being quick on the draw.

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Re: I think it has something to do with it


Jul 24, 2013, 3:34 PM

From that perspective, I see it as a credit to the official for not being biased in that situation.

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Re: I think it has something to do with it


Jul 24, 2013, 3:44 PM

I don't think it's realistic to think that the official was even considering military appreciation day at the time. When play starts, he's focused much more on the game than what's happening on the sidelines. It's not even until half time when we get all the vets in attendance involved that it would even register.

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The real story here is that those uniforms look atrocious


Jul 25, 2013, 1:52 PM [ in reply to Re: I think it has something to do with it ]

I forgot how bad those things were. I'm glad that we've gone with the more traditional looks recently because we looked like a bunch of circus clowns in those things.

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Maybe he was a Virginia Tech fan.....***


Jul 24, 2013, 9:38 PM [ in reply to I think it has something to do with it ]



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Re: I think it has something to do with it


Jul 25, 2013, 1:14 PM [ in reply to I think it has something to do with it ]

You, Sir, have it absolutely correct, and that is from an Air Force Vietnam Vet. and a Clemson grad.

I salute you!

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Also, 2 officials threw flags, what is the other guys story.


Jul 24, 2013, 5:29 PM [ in reply to It still should not have been flagged ]

Can't pick and chose your stories ACC to try and make your nonsensical calls look better.

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Re: It still should not have been flagged


Jul 24, 2013, 5:52 PM [ in reply to It still should not have been flagged ]

You are all over it! Ref was just being a hot dog, IMO, and his giving an unwarranted penalty against us is absolutely unrelated to anything he did as a result of anything else. A simple warning and a caution to both coaches would have done the job. Now, do I like the taunting, the spiking, the running up into the stands and touching fans, etc.? NO, but the flag still was uncalled for.

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Re: It still should not have been flagged


Jul 24, 2013, 6:23 PM

and it won't be in the future after the super conferences move away from the mickey mouse rules of the have nots.

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I've seen players salute since this call with no flags


Jul 24, 2013, 3:29 PM

That was just uncalled for. Warning at best.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 3:36 PM

so the guy who threw the flag after our first TD in the VA game lives in VA...hmmm...

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 3:48 PM

A salute is a sign of RESPECT, and it always has been. Reff over reacted!!!

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Listening to the explination makes the flag more idiotic


Jul 24, 2013, 3:51 PM

Becuase the gesture was done for the exact opposite for everythign he was saying warrents the flag. It wasn't the call attention to himself nor was it a prolonged gesture like a dance or any of the other things he mentioned. It was a gesture of respect and honor for our flag and the military on MILITARY appreciation day.

I was at that game and the crowd reaction wehn the flag was thrown was equal parts shocked and outraged.

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Inexplacably idiotic***


Jul 24, 2013, 4:07 PM



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The call was bogus!


Jul 24, 2013, 5:32 PM [ in reply to Listening to the explination makes the flag more idiotic ]

Since that game I have noticed several players saluting without any flags and I have noticed many of the throat slashing motions with no (zero) flags. I don't think the salutes should be flagged but the throat slashing should be flagged every time and should be enforceable on booth reviews if the guys on the field miss it. What happened to sportsmanship?

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"Heavyweight fights have their ring walks. CFB has Clemson's grandest entrance in sports."
Chris Fowler


If we're simply going to abide by the wording of the rule..


Jul 24, 2013, 3:59 PM

"A player cannot have a prolonged, delayed, or excessive, or choreographed act by which they draw attention to themselves." In my opinion they're talking about "Tebowing"...taking a knee in the end zone for an extended period of time in a definitely choreographed manner that draws attention to themselves. This therefore is a penalty...Have you ever seen anyone penalized for this? It seems just as legitimate as saluting...to me. However, sometimes common sense just has to win.

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If the ### hole's in you it'll come out sooner or later.***


Jul 24, 2013, 4:10 PM



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The call was total BS just like the explanation***


Jul 24, 2013, 4:14 PM



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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Re: The call was total BS just like the explanation- yep and


Jul 24, 2013, 4:31 PM

why drag it up 4 years later. Seems the conference has a bit of guilt over this. The director of officials and ref who threw the flag are idiots. and I dont frankly give a carp if the ref was a first responder or not

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Re: The call was total BS just like the explanation- yep and


Jul 25, 2013, 1:31 PM

74TIGER, this situation is the same as all other controversial situations in a free society. If something wrong is done, and no one objects, then it is deemed to be okay by the offender. That is not a slap on the individual official, but is a "minor" slap on the Director of Officiating in the ACC because he did not inform the officials adequately of the Special Day. If you look at ACC games every year, as I do, you will see some inconsistency in the "celebration" call. Officials are "in the moment" and have to make instant decisions but I do believe that they need to be "in the moment" about that particular day and what is being celebrated by both teams, like Military Appreciation Day. Enough said by this Veteran!

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 4:17 PM

They can explain this stuff away all they wish - but when someone salutes MY FLAG, I'd better not see a dayum flag thrown. Check out his salute - dayum fine salute IMO. If someone throws a flag on that, they're on my bad list immediately and forever.

Let's hope that ref never gets the privilege of reffing our games. That would be wrong in so many ways.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 4:17 PM

If any of you expected Ron Cherry or his crew to use good judgement in a game, then you haven't seen that clown ref many football games! Talk about a guy who needs to go back through the training program...

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 4:19 PM

If any of you expected Ron Cherry or his crew to use good judgement in a game, then you haven't seen that clown ref many football games! Talk about a guy who needs to go back through the training program...

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Rhodes is a ####.***


Jul 24, 2013, 4:22 PM



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There's something in these hills.


In my experience, Rhodes is going to defend ACC officials...


Jul 24, 2013, 4:28 PM

regardless of how badly they botch a call.

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Sometimes good things fall apart so better things can fall together.


Was at the game. The salute (gesture) was over faster than


Jul 24, 2013, 4:23 PM

it took Ron to announce the call over the PA. Was NOT intended to draw attention to the player in any way. Maybe it could be said this was the case if Dwayne had turned to the UVa bench and made the salute or something like that. This explanation really changes nothing with the fact that the ref who threw the flag was seriously over reacting.

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Flag was uncalled for.


Jul 24, 2013, 4:32 PM

And, glad we weren't flagged for boo'ing the POTUS, which he continues to deserve.

(Yeah, I opened that can)

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"When I was young, I was sure of many things; now there are only two things of which I am sure: one is, that I am a miserable sinner; and the other, that Christ is an all-sufficient Saviour. He is well-taught who learns these two lessons." -John Newton


Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 4:44 PM

"There is one final piece to the story, however. Rhoads said that he received emails and letters from fans who said that he and the official who threw the flag were un-American and not very patriotic. The official who threw the flag was back judge Pat Ryan, who is a firefighter in the Washington, D.C. area of Virginia. Ryan was one of the very first responders on the scene on 9/11 when the plane flew into The Pentagon."

Ryan was doing the job he was being paid to do on 9/11 and when he threw the flag, neither has anything to do with validating that he is an America Patriot or patriotic

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CJ did the same thing a few years earlier


Jul 24, 2013, 4:50 PM

on Military Appreciation Day. It's not like we didn't know what would happen. The rules are in place for a reason. We get burned, but so do other.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 4:52 PM

Ron Cherry has shown up until a year ago to make some of the most ridiculous calls, that 'seem' to favor whomever Clemson is playing. He lacks leadership and integrity to make good solid calls...it's almost like he wants to be the center of attention- not let the boys play.

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I for one like a rule with no gray areas. It is easier to


Jul 24, 2013, 5:14 PM

follow.

Also, I know no one like to mention it...but most white people hate those stupid dances that the players use to have.

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Speak for yourself cracker.***


Jul 24, 2013, 5:47 PM



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cracker is a racial slur to white folks


Jul 25, 2013, 12:36 PM

So if you keep using slurs like this it makes you a racist. Granted the wording of his post isn't "color" accurate, but two wrongs don't make a right....just saying :)

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Meanwhile, felons at UNC & USC are getting off the hook


Jul 24, 2013, 5:16 PM

While Clemson kids are honoring the military & saving families from burning cars...I'll take the flag & idiocy of the ACC officials every so often.

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What a load of crap and I could care less about


Jul 24, 2013, 5:18 PM

whether the official that threw the flag was a first responder at the Pentagon on 9/11. That doesn't give him carte blanche to be an a-hole.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 5:26 PM

I didn't like the call, but I am probably a little one sided toward Clemson.
Here is an idea: Score, hand the ball to the referee and then go to the sidelines. You know, like it is something that you do all the time.
Let the cheerleaders do the dancing.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 5:36 PM

Somebody E-mail Mr. Rhoads and ask him why this flag is only called selectively. Shouldn't it be called on everybody.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 6:32 PM

Using the Mr. Rhoad's logic, why isn't everyone that stops, drops to his knees and prays not flagged. It fits his definition. It is just another example of not calling out the incompetence of the these non-professional officials.

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Probably would have been ignored if it was another ACC team.***


Jul 24, 2013, 6:53 PM



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Did he explain the phantom holding calls against Clemson


Jul 24, 2013, 7:06 PM

when they played G.T. a few years ago that directly affected Clemson's chances to win the ACC championship?
Hope that official is gone. He exacted that punishment on Clemson 2 years in a row.

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Not to get your blood pressure up, but it was 3 games in a


Jul 24, 2013, 9:44 PM

row in two years!!! At the almost exact same instance in each game.

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What a load of equine excrement.***


Jul 24, 2013, 7:32 PM



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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 7:44 PM

...well the refs clearly missed flagging half of the Miami Hurricanes when the thugs last visited Death Valley. They were throat slashing and holding their crouches when they scored late in the game. The side and back judges were looking right at them.

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Hmmm, we were playing Virginia and the official that threw


Jul 24, 2013, 7:48 PM

The flag was also from Virginia.

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Re: Hmmm, we were playing Virginia and the official that threw


Jul 24, 2013, 8:27 PM

took this long for anyone else to pick it up
point

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I got to talk to Dwayne Allen at the fan fest the next year


Jul 24, 2013, 8:18 PM

Like Dwayne,I too have similar Fayetteville and military background. I told him if we got up on NC State that year by 3 TD's just go ahead an jump in the *@&$! stands with the ROTC. I got a big laugh out of Dwayne

If I was Dabo and or TDP I would have the whole #### team run down to the fence after every TD during the Military Appreciation day game tell the ACC Clemson started a new tradition.

That call was lame and so was this head official explanation.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 9:19 PM

Maybe I'm missing something, but I still see no concrete explanation in all the crap that he said that explains why this was a legitimate penalty.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 24, 2013, 9:25 PM

I don't get that last paragraph...that, of all things should have been a reason to NOT throw the flag. Very lame excuse.

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David, would it be too much trouble to call him and ask why


Jul 24, 2013, 9:34 PM

another ACC player who DID THE SAME THING, did not draw penalty?

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The "Story" Behind Dwayne Allen's Salute...


Jul 24, 2013, 10:38 PM

Isn't the head of officials


"Bob" Rhoads?????

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It's a subjective call, officials would probably...


Jul 25, 2013, 12:57 AM

have patted Dwayne on the back if he played for a tobacco road school. Not buying what Rhodes is selling.

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Re: Front Page Story: The Story Behind Dwayne Allen's Saluting Penalty


Jul 25, 2013, 12:38 PM

The head of officials said the official "had" to make this call. Nonsense, on military appreciation day! The fellow is just defending his employee. A simple warning to the coaches would have done the same job.

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