|
Replies: 63
| visibility 51
|
Scout Team [166]
TigerPulse: 66%
Posts: 99
Joined: 3/13/99
|
Tiger Woods is a scumbag!
Apr 13, 2013, 9:59 AM
|
|
He needs to disqualify himself!
|
|
|
|
 |
CU Medallion [60244]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42567
Joined: 11/30/98
|
are you watching the Golf Channel right now?
Apr 13, 2013, 10:02 AM
|
|
they are almost all calling for him to DQ himself. This is a career-ruiner is what they are saying (wow).
|
|
|
|
|
|
Scout Team [166]
TigerPulse: 66%
Posts: 99
Joined: 3/13/99
|
I have been watching all morning.
Apr 13, 2013, 10:07 AM
|
|
Everyone is calling for him to DQ himself. If he does not he will never live this down. I can't stand him already. He should have already DQ'ed himself and the fact that he has not shows that he has no honor.
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [60244]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42567
Joined: 11/30/98
|
I'm gonna wait and see if he actually tees off or not
Apr 13, 2013, 10:12 AM
|
|
I can't imagine him playing now with some of the strong opinion I am hearing.
If he was to continue and actually win - the fallout would rock the PGA.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [14751]
TigerPulse: 93%
Posts: 22551
Joined: 5/14/03
|
i think you are right, he doesn't tee off.***
Apr 13, 2013, 10:27 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [10171]
TigerPulse: 79%
Posts: 17654
Joined: 11/30/98
|
You know nothing about golf rules***
Apr 13, 2013, 11:54 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [14751]
TigerPulse: 93%
Posts: 22551
Joined: 5/14/03
|
you know nothing about ratings.***
Apr 13, 2013, 1:14 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [55851]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 35354
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Golf used to be a gentleman's game. Augusta tries to pretend
Apr 13, 2013, 10:13 AM
|
|
it still is.
Tiger exposes the hypocrisy.
It's all about the Benjamins, just like everything else.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [24875]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42691
Joined: 7/31/10
|
You hit the sweet spot on that. Preferential prerogatives
Apr 13, 2013, 10:56 AM
|
|
for the pompous.
|
|
|
|
|
|
110%er [9107]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 14107
Joined: 11/5/05
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [21594]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 13926
Joined: 9/7/02
|
Why should he DQ himself?
Apr 13, 2013, 10:13 AM
|
|
The rule is so gray! Its not like he could go back and find the exact spot anyways...the divot had been replaced.
F### David Feherty!
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [60244]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42567
Joined: 11/30/98
|
divot is clear on the TV shot.
Apr 13, 2013, 10:20 AM
|
|
Only one nearby.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [14751]
TigerPulse: 93%
Posts: 22551
Joined: 5/14/03
|
Because he admits he INTENTIONALLY dropped it
Apr 13, 2013, 10:26 AM
[ in reply to Why should he DQ himself? ] |
|
two yards back vs. doing it by accident.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
Disagree. Two things - TV clearly showed the previous divot
Apr 13, 2013, 10:33 AM
[ in reply to Why should he DQ himself? ] |
|
while Tiger hit after his drop. Second and most ####ing, Tiger stated in his Friday interview that dropped 2 yards back to get a better yardage. (He was gaining an advantage).
So, he obviously knew where previously hit, where he wanted to be for the drop, gained an advantage, executed those actions in violation of the rules, and signed his incorrect scorecard.
He should DQ himself....
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [68114]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 115566
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Re: the rules of golf should apply to all
Apr 13, 2013, 10:51 AM
|
|
unless you will bring a different demographic and boost tv ratings. then just do what you want and we've got your back.
Ironic considering all the years Augusta was panned for not allowing certain minorities to play
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
Yep, Master's committee has used lawyer-speak to
Apr 13, 2013, 10:55 AM
|
|
stretch/interpret rules and keep Tiger in the tourney. I'm willing to bet if this was anyone else, they would've been DQ'd last night....
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [81996]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 47129
Joined: 3/18/07
|
No, there was a rule change after Harrington...***
Apr 28, 2024, 12:53 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [24875]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42691
Joined: 7/31/10
|
Rule doesn't even apply to this situation. Merely an 'out'.***
Apr 13, 2013, 11:00 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [81996]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 47129
Joined: 3/18/07
|
No, there was a specific ammendment to the rule after
Apr 13, 2013, 11:03 AM
|
|
what happened to Padraig...it clearly applies in this situation. I get people hate Tiger vehemently, but the fact is he did not intentionally break the rules, no official said a word to him, and it was done unknowingly.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
Hey Soccer, see my post below. Clearly 2 diff scenarios.***
Apr 13, 2013, 11:08 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [68114]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 115566
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Re: they did but the whole problem in golf is
Apr 13, 2013, 11:02 AM
[ in reply to No, there was a rule change after Harrington...*** ] |
|
the aspect of letting a tv viewer call in and insinuate there is a violation. this is an HD tv rule for the ball moving unbeknown to the player and him signing an incorrect card. if the player fails to follow the rules that is on them.
I dont think he set out to break a rule and after hitting the flag and going in the water you could argue he didnt gain an advantage but if it was almost any other player they'd be gone
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
Different situation with Paddy. He didn't see the ball move
Apr 13, 2013, 11:06 AM
[ in reply to No, there was a rule change after Harrington...*** ] |
|
and had no intention of gaining an advantage.
Tiger clearly broke the rule (albeit unknowingly, but doesn't absolve from breaking said rule) and even stated himself, moved 2 yards for better shot = gaining advantage.
When Tiger's intent was to improve shot, any rules to allow him continued play, should be null/void.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [81996]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 47129
Joined: 3/18/07
|
Not really different.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:11 AM
|
|
Paddy clearly broke the rule (definitely unknowingly)...
In his opinions he gained an advantage, the rules state gaining an advantage as getting closer to the hole, not farther away.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
Ok, so what if there was a tree in front? Dropping farther
Apr 13, 2013, 11:14 AM
|
|
back to able to hit a shot isn't gaining an advantage?
Regardless, Tiger said he wanted better yardage, which is gaining an advantage.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [81996]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 47129
Joined: 3/18/07
|
I believe the big argument at hand is that Tiger was
Apr 13, 2013, 11:19 AM
|
|
unaware he broke the rules. Frankly, he was within two club lengths behind the original spot, which in a lot of rule statements is kosher. I do not believe he was intentionally violating the rules, and thus, by the rule that was changed after Harrington, he was assessed a 2-stroke penalty.
All because the pin absolutely hosed him on a great shot.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
Took an 8 on an incredibly played hole of golf.***
Apr 13, 2013, 11:20 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
Again, being unaware of breaking rules does not absolve
Apr 13, 2013, 11:32 AM
[ in reply to I believe the big argument at hand is that Tiger was ] |
|
you from said rules.
The tipping point for me was Tiger's improvement intent with the drop.
If his interview went, "Yeah, I was mad, dropped close to the divot and hit my next shot". I would be fine with the 2 shot penalty and allow him to play.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [81996]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 47129
Joined: 3/18/07
|
Being unaware of the rule you broke and signing your
Apr 13, 2013, 11:34 AM
|
|
scorecard absolves you from disqualification when some spineless twit calls in your violation. That's the freaking point of the rule change after Harrington!
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rock Defender [54]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
|
I use the rules to gain an advantage all the time.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:29 AM
[ in reply to Not really different. ] |
|
Why risk taking three shots to get the ball out a bush when I can just take an unplayable? Why play the ball off the slope of a creek I hit into when I can go sideways two clubs and get a flat lie?
This seems like a lot of arbitrary (and hypocritical?) outrage over the degree to which Tiger gained an advantage, here. I mean, it's not as if he walked up and dropped on the green.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
Not sure if my point came across correctly.
Apr 13, 2014, 8:55 PM
|
|
My reference to Tiger's continued play was about the Master's committee ruling after he signed wrong scorecard.
Continued play = playing today/tomorrow.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
I'm saying you think he should be DQd because
Apr 13, 2013, 11:26 AM
|
|
He had an intent to gain an advantage. If he was trying to gain an advantage, he was doing so on the incorrect drop, which has a stroke penalty. The DQ penalty would have been based on signing and incorrect scorecard. I definitely don't think he did that on purpose, or with an intent to gain advantage.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
Yes, the DQ should be for incorrect scorecard.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:38 AM
|
|
My argument is about the committee ruling.
The committee should not use the loophole rule for Tiger because of his advantage intent.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
I don't even think he was knowingly breaking a rule
Apr 13, 2013, 11:41 AM
|
|
In the first place. He was trying to gain an advantage by dropping a couple of feet back, but that doesn't necessarily mean he was knowingly doing it illegally. Aren't there other scenarios in which you can legally do precisely that on a drop, to gain an "advantage" of a better lie? Like Furyk's on the same hole?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rock Defender [54]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [60244]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42567
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Prod - he admitted in an interview he dropped the ball
Apr 13, 2013, 11:40 AM
[ in reply to I'm saying you think he should be DQd because ] |
|
in the spot he did (two yards further back) intentionally to gain an advantage. He did not intentionally break a rule....but that doesn't matter. Like most rules/laws, ignorance is not an valid excuse. And NO ONE ever in history has signed an incorrect scorecard on purpose. But the penalty for doing so is disqualification.
This is professional golf, not other sports (and not even amateur golf) where cheating is attempted on every play. This is a game of honor and integrity. The "common sense" view is black and white - you break a rule, you pay severe consequences, kind of a "death penalty for littering" it seems.
The problem that Tiger faces now, is OFF the course, not on it. If he plays - and wins - he will go to his grave in a bad light for this. Not to his adoring fans and non-golfers, but to the core group that matters - his peers and forefathers. I'm sure Tiger, and even his worst enemy, doesn't want that.
If he withdraws, he gains fans for his ethics. If he plays, he'll never remove this scar off his record. It's unfortunate, but it's very clear from the last 2 hours I have spent watching the reaction from over a dozen people on TGC.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
Everything I've seen from golf people on TV and on Twitter
Apr 13, 2013, 11:43 AM
|
|
Support the decision of the 2-shot penalty. So I don't think there would be much backlash. I think it's just a good exercise of common sense, and one the Tour should continue to exercise going forward.
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [60244]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42567
Joined: 11/30/98
|
you are obviously watching a different universe of media
Apr 13, 2013, 11:47 AM
|
|
than I am then. Even his best friend on tour Notah Begay is resigned to the fact that Tiger needs to assess this very carefully before he tees it up today.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
I was watching on ESPN earlier.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:49 AM
|
|
Everyone on there liked the decision. The national writers I follow on Twitter seem to like it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [60244]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42567
Joined: 11/30/98
|
this must be a FoxNews/MSNBC-ish moment
Apr 13, 2013, 11:54 AM
|
|
everybody on the Golf Channel says he needs to throw it in this week.
now we just need to figure out which one is playing the part of MSNBC, and which channel Tiger is watching from his hotel 
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rock Defender [54]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
|
FWIW, ESPN has had the most lenient take.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:57 AM
[ in reply to I was watching on ESPN earlier. ] |
|
Golf Channel/CBS guys have lit him up.
Greame McDowell tweeted something to the effect of, "take Tiger out of it, and its a fair ruling. Because its tiger there will be a debate about tv ratings"
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [24875]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42691
Joined: 7/31/10
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [81996]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 47129
Joined: 3/18/07
|
There are how many rules officials watching him?
Apr 13, 2013, 10:58 AM
|
|
The 2-stroke penalty is justifiable over the DQ.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Scout Team [166]
TigerPulse: 66%
Posts: 99
Joined: 3/13/99
|
Golf is a game of honor
Apr 13, 2013, 11:03 AM
|
|
Every golfer polices himself. The officials are not there as policemen. They are there to answer any question the players have on the rules. We already know tiger has no honor. Now we know it applies to all areas of his life. He cheated on his wife and now he is cheating on the game that has given him everything. No individual is bigger than the game.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [81996]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 47129
Joined: 3/18/07
|
I'd bet $100 you take two balls off the first tee, you fluff
Apr 13, 2013, 11:04 AM
|
|
your lie, and you take an occasional mulligan. Don't say that golf is a game of honor.
The officials are there to catch rule violations AND to answer questions...
You don't know a thing about his personal life, but make all the assumptions you want. Who gives a #### what he does off the course?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Scout Team [166]
TigerPulse: 66%
Posts: 99
Joined: 3/13/99
|
I play golf for fun, not for millions of dollars.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:08 AM
|
|
That being said, I absolutely follow the rules of golf in any tournament I play. You know nothing about me. I know Tiger cheated on his wife, and now made an illegal drop to gain an advantage. He has no honor. If it makes you feel better saying I don't follw the rules of golf, okay. Doesn't change what is going on in Augusta.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [24875]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42691
Joined: 7/31/10
|
He broke the rule, admitted it, and got a pass. BS. This
Apr 13, 2013, 11:10 AM
[ in reply to I'd bet $100 you take two balls off the first tee, you fluff ] |
|
isn't about some weekend golfer. It's about the #1 golfer in the world at the the most preeminent golf tournament in the world openly being given special treatment in direct conflict with the established rules.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
A 2-shot penalty is not pass.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:15 AM
|
|
To me, that's a very stiff penalty. Kudos to the officials for not overreacting and enacting some common sense. Lord knows we need more of that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rock Defender [54]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Hope he shoots 63 today and REALLY pisses people off.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:00 AM
|
|
Nothing funnier than a bunch of uppity golf purists getting all crabby about the integrity of the game when they take two shots off the first and roll 'em in the fairways in their regular Saturday game. Even funnier that the loudest complaints are coming from the same folks (Golf Channel, Faldo, Chamblee, etc.) that were giving the ANGC rules officials a hard time yesterday for docking the kid for slow play.
Tiger should have made 4 and wound up taking 8. A four stroke penalty for having hit a great shot in the first place seems more than fair for whatever advantage he gained in his drop.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [24875]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42691
Joined: 7/31/10
|
Tell that to De Vincenzo.***
Apr 13, 2013, 11:04 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [68114]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 115566
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Re: Tell that to De Vincenzo.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:12 AM
|
|
Going to be tough I think he's dead
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [24875]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42691
Joined: 7/31/10
|
Apparently golf's 'honor' died with him.***
Apr 13, 2013, 11:13 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
CU Medallion [60244]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 42567
Joined: 11/30/98
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rock Defender [54]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Speaking of DJ, he chunked one in the water on 15.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:31 AM
|
|
Did anyone go back and check the honor of his subsequent drop?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Scout Team [166]
TigerPulse: 66%
Posts: 99
Joined: 3/13/99
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
They are applying a rule by not DQing him.
Apr 13, 2013, 11:13 AM
|
|
You just don't like that rule.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
They are mis-applying a rule to keep him in the tourney.
Apr 13, 2013, 12:06 PM
|
|
The revised USGA Decision 33-7 is supposed to be invoked for “facts a player could not have known”, such as not knowing the ball oscillated forward (aka Padraig Harrington) as opposed to not knowing the rules (ignorance).
Tiger took an illegal drop (which he should've known), didn't penalize himself, and signed an incorrect score card.
Pretty open and shut case for me.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [81996]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 47129
Joined: 3/18/07
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-TigerNet [10171]
TigerPulse: 79%
Posts: 17654
Joined: 11/30/98
|
You know nothing about golf rules...
Apr 13, 2013, 11:51 AM
|
|
According to the USGA website, the "revision to Decision 33-7/4.5 addresses the situation where a player is not aware he has breached a Rule because of facts that he did not know and could not reasonably have discovered prior to returning his score card. Under this revised decision and at the discretion of the Committee, the player still receives the penalty associated with the breach of the underlying Rule, but is not disqualified.''
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [2986]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 1391
Joined: 12/25/99
|
How does Tiger NOT know the rules? Heck, he could've
Apr 13, 2013, 12:14 PM
|
|
just called an official and cleared it up before signing the card.
That is the issue with this revision.
"..because of facts that he did not know and could not reasonably have discovered..."
The rules in Tiger's drop are clear, he should've known he did an illegal drop.
Ignorance of the rule does not absolve Tiger in this rule.
|
|
|
|
|
|
All-In [26968]
TigerPulse: 96%
Posts: 44823
Joined: 7/6/10
|
On ESPN, they're saying that officials told him he was OK.***
Apr 13, 2013, 12:59 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Rock Defender [54]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
|
Tiger just tweeted that he believed his drop was legal.***
Apr 13, 2013, 11:59 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Replies: 63
| visibility 51
|
|
|
50
