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110%er [7971]
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Standout [308]
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I always did like Sherman...
Nov 4, 2016, 10:13 AM
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Similar to what Dabo said as well... sports is a way to put our differences aside for a few hours and come together as a community.
I am so grateful that our coaches and players don't participate in that crud because it would take away from the one of the few "escapes" I get.
Go Tigers!!
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CU Medallion [58448]
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He's full of #####. If you want "entertainment", go to
Nov 4, 2016, 10:46 AM
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the !@##$%^ circus or a WWE event. This is football, a sport, with rules and history and fanfare and traditions, and that in itself makes it entertaining to those who have more than a 10 second attention span.
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CU Guru [1092]
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Re: He's full of #####. If you want "entertainment", go to
Nov 4, 2016, 10:58 AM
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Well .... he's partially correct. While I agree with your statement regarding traditions etc., part of what made the NFL was the "fun". Watch any NFL Films of the greatest teams and players of the 80's and you'll see celebrations everywhere, from the Posse, to Bo, to LT.
But today's game feels "heavy", like the game cannot get out from its own way in terms of seriousness of injuries and other non-sport related topics, on-field replay disputes etc. The hyper analyzing of a shoelace ...
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CU Medallion [58448]
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There are a lot of things they could do to attract a larger
Nov 4, 2016, 12:56 PM
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audience, many of which would be disastrous for the game. I do agree that the "hyper analyzing of a shoelace" aspect and replay disputes are bad for the game.
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Legend [15914]
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110%er [6592]
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he's partially right, but its a combo of things
Nov 4, 2016, 11:52 AM
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1) NFL trying to be politically correct on everything
2) the announcers (especially Bob Costas) continually interject political issues (ie gun control, etc) into their broadcasts.
3) Continuing on #2 the NFL has allowed the players to hijack the NFL stage to display their own political agendas and people are tired of it. (hands up dont shoot, Star Spangled Banner, etc) Just play football, I guarantee if I went on TV wearing my company logo and spouted off my opinion (right, wrong, or indifferent) on controversial issues that offended part of our company's market base, I would be fired immediately or at least severely reprimanded.
4) Its seems like every other play, there is a question on what constitutes a catch or not? Did the defense breathe on the other team? Oh no they dared to even get close to the qb.
5) Poor product. What used to make me a NFL first fan (except Clemson games) was the fundamentals across the board was just much better and produced a much cleaner product IMO. Generally, fundamentally sound players went against each other and the best man won, it wasnt scheme, it wasnt that the other guy had poor technique that made him get beat, it was that guy beat that guy straight up. Now it seems like the fundamentals are lacking, more busts on def., dropped passes, missed tackles, qb play is down. I also feel like there is a lack of premiere guys, there are a lot of good players, but I think the amount of household name superstars are down.
All of this combines for the perfect storm, as the league has damaged its image with both the football purest (reasons #4 and #5) and the casual fan that watches for just entertainment value but can take it or leave it (Reasons 1-3). If the league's talent was good and there was a controversy you might lose the casual fan for a bit, but you would have the football purest to hold you until you got back in good graces again and the issue passes. If talent is down a bit, you can get by with the casual fan if there are no controversial issues, plus most football people understand there are down years occasionally. You have controversy and talent is down, you are screwed.
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All-TigerNet [14090]
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That was predictable a right winger finding a way to blame it on liberals...
Nov 4, 2016, 12:09 PM
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Yeah you are right about the political correctness part, the NFL has found a way to ban nearly every type of celebration just to satisfy a bunch of uptight right wingers. By the way Bob Costas shows up on one NFL show, Sunday night football, in which has very little airtime. If you are that uptight that you can't take a few minutes of a broadcaster life must be real miserable for you.
Oh yeah QB play is not down. If fundamentals were an issue for you, you wouldn't be watching college football, because NFL players fundamentals are 1000 times better than college players.
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Legend [16160]
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1000 times better? I would like to see the formula you used
Nov 4, 2016, 12:59 PM
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arrive at that calculation
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110%er [6139]
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ESPN came up with it***
Nov 4, 2016, 1:02 PM
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110%er [6139]
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Legend [16160]
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yes PC is a Lib plague***
Nov 4, 2016, 1:10 PM
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CU Guru [1676]
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Re: yes PC is a Lib plague***
Nov 4, 2016, 1:19 PM
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I think we've found the answer, all of this b.s. is driving me off this thread, too
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All-TigerNet [14090]
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wrong. PC comes from left, right, and center...
Nov 4, 2016, 2:08 PM
[ in reply to The predictalbe left winger found a way to blame ] |
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There are different kinds of forms of PC. Just like in the build up to the Iraq War it was politically incorrect to be against it.
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Legend [16160]
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there are different kinds of forms of it? Redundant much?***
Nov 4, 2016, 5:44 PM
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CU Medallion [51552]
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Orange Blooded [2340]
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ACC Championship Game in Charlotte was ruined by both progressives and conservatives
Nov 5, 2016, 3:39 AM
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If the conservatives would have done a better job of wording the bathroom bill I'm the state legislature, and if progressives would stop with the PC social justice warrior overreacting then we would all be able to go to a de facto home game in Charlotte again this year just like last year and back in 2011. Either group could have prevented this from happening.
It's absolutely nuts for a person to be able to go into whichever bathroom they feel like regardless of sex, but it's also nuts to force a person that was born a woman 50 years ago but had a sex change operation and hormonal therapy 30 years ago that looks like a man and has been living like a man for decades to use the woman bathroom. Both scenarios could potentially allow a "man" to use the bathroom with my young niece or hypothetical daughter.
It is admittedly an extremely difficult problem, but in this day and age where society has become okay with sex changes and transgender acceptance, perhaps require people to use the restroom of the sex that they have been living their life as. Don't allow perverted men that have acted and dressed like men their whole lives to use the little girls' room, but don't force a person who was born a woman but has been living as a man for decades with hormone therapy and possibly misc surgeries to use the little girls' room either.
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110%er [6139]
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Orange Blooded [2340]
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I appreciate your point of view although I disagree on many points
Nov 5, 2016, 1:49 AM
[ in reply to he's partially right, but its a combo of things ] |
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I don't think the decline in number of viewers is an issue that can be pinned down to a small number of reasons that can be addressed in order to solve the problem.
While it may be true that there are several miscellaneous issues that can be analyzed in an effort to try to reverse the trend, I personally think there are a couple primary reasons for the decline that cannot be addressed in order to reverse the recent trend.
First, it is undeniable that college football has been gradually increasing in popularity for well over a decade now. The popularity of the NFL and college football are certainly not mutually exclusive, but for a large contingent of viewers, they very well have their fill of football on Saturday to the point that they don't tune in on Sunday. For people who are either too busy or only casually interested enough to be able to watch football on both Saturday and Sunday, the popularity of college football could have an effect on NFL viewership. This certainly wouldn't be the primary reason for the decline, but it is a reason to believe that the decline could easily continue.
Secondly, I think that the NFL has been a victim of the overall decline of traditional television viewers as more and more people "cut the cord" with the increased availability of various other sources of content. Compared to other sports and college football specifically, the NFL has always had considerably more casual fans and viewers than the others. Compared to college football, for example, the NFL has a much smaller number of teams, which means that for the ultra casual viewer, they would be more prone to watch an NFL game featuring a team that they are familiar with. It is these casual viewers that are being lost and will continue to be lost as more and more people "cut the cord."
For loss of viewership that isn't related to industry wide trends that are unlikely to be able to be reversed, there are likely a large number of various reasons. I want to comment on some of the reasons listed in this thread specifically.
First, I don't think that it has anything at all to do with a left-wing or right-wing ideology. As far as liberal political positions being included in football coverage, I don't think that is something that is being included in the actual games. Because it is the number of people watching the actual games that has been analyzed to show a large decline, I don't think it is very imp
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Orange Blooded [2340]
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..... continued
Nov 5, 2016, 2:00 AM
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I don't think Bob Costa's halftime commentary should be considered to play a central role in the decline. If Joe Buck and Troy Aikman were providing the same analysis instead of play-by-play and color commentary during the game, I think it would have a much larger impact. Whether you agree with Costa's political alignment and analysis, the simple fact remains that it is only a very short halftime editorial. It can be reasonably argued that Costas as analysis comes from a progressive slant, but even if it is somewhat off-putting to conservatives, these conservatives only make up 40-45 percent of present day America. Unlike where this country stood ideologically 12-16 years ago at the time of President Bush's election in 2000 and 2004, the population is now ideologically center-left as opposed to center-right as before. Inst
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Orange Blooded [2340]
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Re: ..... continued
Nov 5, 2016, 2:17 AM
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Instead of being 55-60 percent self-identified conservative like it was in 2004, America is now 55-60 percent self-identified progressive.
While Bob Costas' brief halftime commentary likely isn't affecting viewership, political infiltration overall could absolutely be "turning people off" (pun entirely accidental). The overwhelming majority of NFL viewers do not want their weekly escape from the neverending barrage of political triviality to be inundated with the same political garbage that has bled into every other bastion of American life.
Whether you are a progressive that believes that Colin Kaepernick is exercising his right to free speech, or you are a conservative that believes that Colin Kaepernick is disrespecting the sacrifice and commitment of America's heroes in uniform, you likely agree that the amount of attention and media coverage of Kaepernick's "protest" has been the most off-putting aspect of the entire situation.
Regardless of where you stand (pun entirely accidental yet again) on this issue, it would be best for everyone if people would just shut up about it already. Look no further than the misunderstanding of Dwayne Allen kneeling in prayer toward the end of the anthem (just like he has done for several years now) to see how little people have been paying attention to this in recent memory prior to SB Nation posting the picture of Kaepernick sitting for the anthem in the preseason. Stop talking about it and maybe people can begin to move on. If you disagree with Kaepernick's behavior, the last thing you should do is to validate his "protest" by giving him incessant attention and providing him with a national/international forum.
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Orange Blooded [2340]
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Re: ..... continued
Nov 5, 2016, 3:23 AM
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Finally, in regards to the football related points as to why ratings are in decline, I partially agree and partially disagree.
It is undeniable that many viewers are drawn to the NFL by a connection they have with a specific team or player(s). Regardless of where this connection originated, there is bound to be a decline in the number of people that form new "connections" with player(s) or teams as the number of casual viewers declines (due in part of aforementioned reasons).
The number of casual viewers that "connected" with teams and players was likely at its peak 10-20 years ago when fantasy was just beginning to take over but before people began to "cut the cord." As more and more players from this era retire from the game, viewership declines correspondingly.
This goes hand in hand with one of your comments about reasons why the NFL is losing viewers, but it isn't quite the same. While it appears to be very possible that the number of household names is on the decline, I wholeheartedly disagree that there has been a decline in quality of play, specifically QB play. This is more of a self-fulfilling prophecy where the number of recognizable names goes down because of the reduction in number of casual viewers, not vice-versa.
I believe that there are just as many great QB's now than at any other time. Peyton Manning's retirement and the decline of aging superstars like Philip Rivers and Drew Beers certainly contributes to your theory, but there are young guys that are filling the void left behind.
Russell Wilson has most of his career ahead of him, and IMO he will prove to be a future first ballot HOFer. Matt Ryan and Matthew Stafford appear to have elevated their game to another level in the past 12 months. Dak Prescott and Carson Wentz are both extremely exciting young signal callers with an insane amount of potential to develop into future HOFers.
Statistically speaking, across the the board, quarterbacks are playing at the highest level that they ever have in NFL history. Just take a quick glance at the production of Bart Starr, Joe Namath, Roger Staubach, and Terry Bradshaw. Then look at Joe Montana, Phil Simms, Joe Theismann, Randall Cunningham, and Jim Kelly. Then look at Troy Aikman, Drew Bledsoe, Trent Dilfer, Neil O'Donnell, Stan Humphries, and Jeff Hosteller. Now look at Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, Matt Ryan, and Ben Roethlisberger. If you haven't ever compared the production of these guys of different eras, words cannot describe just how astonishing the improvement and increase in production is from one decade to the next.
In other areas, I absolutely believe that the overall fundamentals are showing a steady improvement.
Tackling fundamentals have clearly been lacking over the past 20+ years, but they have undeniably been improving in the past few seasons as more focus is placed on tackling because of the increased understanding of the dangers of concussions. The frequency of helmet to helmet spine-tingling hits has been declining with personal foul calls, and defenders are wrapping up again like they used to back in the early nineties and before.
Statistics have shown the number of dropped passes has been steadily declining for well over a decade since this became a regularly recorded statistic. Receivers, ends, and backs are much more adept at catching the football than at any other time in history because of the increased emphasis in catching drills and improved quality of receiving gloves with a much higher coefficient of friction.
I personally don't see any more busted coverage on defense than at any other time in recent memory, but if there are in fact more busted coverages, it is important to consider the drastic increase in the complexity of defensive playcalling. Specifically because of the improvement in play from the QB position, defensive coordinators have had to make their defensive plays and coverage schemes much more complex and difficult to recognize because of more efforts at disguising scheme to try to fool the opposing QB.
I completely disagree that there was ever a time in the past few decades where the NFL came down to a matter where "the best man won" independent of strategy and technique. If strategy wasn't a major, integral part of winning football games then there wouldn't be such a high priority placed on coaching. The simple fact that certain HOF level coaches have been able to have consistent success in the NFL proves how invaluable coaching and strategy are to winning football games in the NFL.
And finally, I couldn't agree more that the incessant questions about what is or isn't a catch and the official reviews that interrupt game play. I don't have any problem with calling personal fouls for helmet to helmet and "targeting," bit unsportsmanlike calls for a little dancing and celebrating takes a lot more away from the game than it adds.
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Hall of Famer [24477]
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Mostly a pride driven comment, I think. He may be partially
Nov 4, 2016, 12:55 PM
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right, but no one thinks a few more dances in the end zone are going to turn around a ratings collapse. Red, white and blue basketballs were fun, but didn't save the ABA.
The market fundamentals are what they are, and it seems to me that people are tired of watching politically motivated networks glorify tone deaf players who are divorced from reality by a lifetime of privilege. This is illustrated, I think, in the fact that Sherman and the media think we care about and will be affected by what he or any player thinks or says. What happened to just plain football? When it stops being about the game, people will turn it off. Tipping points really do exist, I think. You can drive 70 miles an hour - everything seems fine - right up to the edge of the otherwise invisible cliff, and televised sports, and the athetes, might have done this. We'll see.
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All-TigerNet [14090]
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yeah Mackensie Alexander grew up with a lifetime of privilege...
Nov 4, 2016, 2:15 PM
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Yeah you know the comfortable privilege of having to pick oranges in 100 degree humidity in South Florida with his parents just to get by. Or the over privileged Shannon Sharpe, who grew up so privileged that his grandmother had to feed him and Sterling raccoon and squirrels just so they would have something to eat. And especially Richard Sherman who was so overprivileged he grew up in the Crips and Bloods infested community of Compton.
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Hall of Famer [24477]
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Give it a rest. The entire world is not Fox vs MSNBC,
Nov 4, 2016, 4:18 PM
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and economic background is not what I was talking about and you know it....unless the word 'privilege' really has become a PC code word. Hmm?
Yes, elite athletes have, for the most part, been treated differently since about age 14. At age 25 they really think they are generating in value the millions they are paid. They think they deserve a platform, and they think people should listen to them. No one who thinks half a second begrudges them one penny of the money they make. But no one who thinks the remainder of the second thinks they generate any corresponding value. Fine, that's entertainment. But the athletes think they are indeed the center of value. At some point people do say, "No, I'm not paying to watch that."
Or do you have some other explanation for why everyone is tuning them out? Call Barbara Striesand and ask her, I guess.
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All-TigerNet [14090]
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give it a rest? Well then don't bring it up next time...
Nov 4, 2016, 5:52 PM
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And yes they are worth their value because fans pay to see players not an owner sitting in a luxury box. Also, this dip in ratings has just occurred this season. So you are completely overreacting considering football is the number one sport in this country and now other sport comes close to football.
Now go call Taylor Swift and I will wait for another change of a definition.
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Commissioner [901]
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Re: give it a rest? Well then don't bring it up next time...
Nov 4, 2016, 10:27 PM
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Tigerking79 is a COOT!
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Orange Blooded [4378]
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Re: give it a rest? Well then don't bring it up next time...
Nov 5, 2016, 7:05 AM
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I don't know if he's a coot, but I know he's definitely an idiot.
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Legend [16160]
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wait, so he thinks if they get to dance more, the ratings
Nov 4, 2016, 1:09 PM
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will increase? Tell him to take a look around his locker room and count all the new faces...that's why the product is down...In 2011 the NFLPA pushed for raising veteran minimum salary increases that coupled with the restrictions on off-season coaching contact is drastically affecting play on the field...The players wanted more $ and less work, they got it...The teams now cut veterans who can still play because it is cheaper to go with young players...See CJ as an example...But Sherm doesn't want to talk about that...Easier to complain about dancing I guess
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Standout [320]
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Re: wait, so he thinks if they get to dance more, the ratings
Nov 4, 2016, 2:32 PM
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Totally agree w this!
The biggest issue I have will all prof. sports is the turnover. Each year my teams are completely different - w only the franchise player exceptions. It's difficult for me to buy in to a new team each year esp when players and teams are chasing a paycheck/profitability.
I love college sports because of the consistency in players (for at least 3-4 years) and styles.
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Legend [15749]
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To me, it basically comes down to a lack of connection.
Nov 4, 2016, 11:47 PM
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I'll be honest...I haven't watched a second of the NFL since the anthem protests. But it had been fading for me for a long time. The overall decline in ratings, to me, reflects a lack of connection. Death by a thousand paper cuts.
Monday night games used to be on network...now on ESPN. I used to fall upon the game, now I forget it's on.
Games broadcast on Thursdays? I forget they're on...and even if I remembered, they're on the NFL network, which I don't get.
I remember a couple years back when the Panthers wanted $50 million to put freaking escalators in BoA stadium. When there were grumbles, you would start to hear veiled threats about how the Panthers need to be supported and how they may have to go to a town that really backs their team. What? After ONE disagreement?
A couple weeks back there was an NFL game in England. Who cares about the home fans when you can increase market share?
Oh, and building on the term "market share", the business side is way too front and center. You know this because people talk about the "overall quality of the product" and the lack of marketable athletes. Again, what? I just want to watch my team play, not analyze their annual statement.
Players are getting more vocal about what they don't like, or problems they see, or what they are owed. I know that King and others will say "So what? Don't they deserve a say? It's their livelihood." I don't care. It's no fun to read players whining about the league or their contracts or threatening to leave.
And of course, personally, when I see players disrespecting the country during the national anthem and explaining how they won't show respect until their demands are met...eh...I can't support that. "Blah, blah their rights to protest blah blah first amendment blah blah you don't understand." Yeah yeah. I'm not saying they should be thrown in jail. I'm not really calling for any action. I'm saying it severs the connection. Why would I cheer for these people? Why would I give up my Sunday to watch them do their jobs in a way that doesn't thrill me?
The NFL got greedy and the NFL and the players have taken fans for granted. I'm sure it's all correctable but in the meantime I have stuff to do.
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110%er [9301]
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Keyword - Entertainment = NFL
Nov 5, 2016, 12:15 AM
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That is why almost all NFL games are decided by 7 points or less
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Freshman [2]
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Re: Richard Sherman's take on NFL ratings being down***
Nov 5, 2016, 6:49 AM
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Freshman [2]
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Re: Richard Sherman's take on NFL ratings being down
Nov 5, 2016, 6:54 AM
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It isn't the entire reason but some players not standing for the national anthem has definitely had some impact on the ratings being down. GET OFF YOUR KNEES!
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