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Asst Coach [722]
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Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:06 AM
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I know it’s coming and I know it’s all about the money. Ask Maryland how it turned out moving on? Just some food for thought. I mean traveling to lsu or Texas coming here sounds awesome or Ohio state and Michigan. However here are some things that potentially could hurt. No more gathering at the paw. Kiss that goodbye. Those Olympic sports that it costs more to travel because of how much they are playing. How much does this cover those costs or is that separate? Are we really making more money if we’re spending more potentially? I know iptay and and season tickets will sky rocket. It will likely be corporate and big donors at games more then your average fan because those fans that have been the heart and soul now can’t afford these tickets and such with how the economy is. Just some thoughts. It’s a tricky situation and I know it’s coming but makes you think a little bit more doesn’t it.
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110%er [8003]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 18, 2021, 2:54 PM
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Andy Dufrense told Red he had to get busy living or get busy dying.
The money difference in a couple of years will be too much to overcome if we want to compete for championships. Elite recruits will not be interested in playing in a 2nd tier league. I understand and share many of your concerns but I dont see any viable option. As for Maryland, I doubt they would have made much noise in either league.
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Orange Blooded [3901]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:39 AM
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Andy Dufrense told Red he had to get busy living or get busy dying.
The money difference in a couple of years will be too much to overcome if we want to compete for championships. Elite recruits will not be interested in playing in a 2nd tier league. I understand and share many of your concerns but I dont see any viable option. As for Maryland, I doubt they would have made much noise in either league.
Love the Shawshank reference 👌
It fits this situation perfectly.
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110%er [5084]
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Head Coach [768]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 12:52 PM
[ in reply to Re: Grass aint always greener ] |
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The ACC has been a second tier football league for years Clemson made it special and super special in the CFP era...not UNC or FSU or anyone else...we made it special and were in the process of making everyone else take their game to the next level...that will die with us leaving and we will forever be together with the money grubbers!
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CU Medallion [65530]
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I actually suspect Maryland has many millions of reasons why they would say
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:11 AM
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they made the right move. Their days in the sun in the ACC were already pretty much behind them by the time they left this conference, anyway. So, mediocrity in the BIG is nothing different, it just pays better.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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Yep, their basketball program had already
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:17 AM
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declined well before they left the ACC. And outside of a little stretch in the 80s and 3 years in the early 2000s, they've never been more than mediocre at football. They've been perfectly mediocre in the B1G since joining so nothing has changed there aside from getting bigger conference payouts.
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All-American [560]
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B Ross & R Friedgen ****
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:40 AM
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110%er [8003]
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Re: B Ross & R Friedgen ****
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Mar 20, 2024, 9:21 AM
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Friedgen: can I eat your baby?
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All-American [560]
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Fat shaming! (smh) ridiculing the mans weight nice...
Mar 23, 2024, 10:21 AM
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The fat slob was a brilliant offensive mind and a good HC—
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Freshman [6]
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CU Guru [1390]
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Re: I actually suspect Maryland has many millions of reasons why they would say
Mar 20, 2024, 12:22 PM
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Well most coots feel that way. It must be hard knowing you will never have a decent team other than wimminz bb!!
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CU Guru [1209]
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Legend [18798]
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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I know some Maryland fans and none of them
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:15 AM
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have any regrets about moving except for the occasional basketball nostalgia.
Honestly, why should they? I think they came out ahead in the deal considering the ACC is crumbling right now and we are scrambling to get out before it collapses on top of us.
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Orange Blooded [3384]
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Re: I know some Maryland fans and none of them
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:30 AM
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Lowest average price at Clemson is $79, Michigan $93
Average cost of tickets Clemson $438, Michigan $548. So yes, ticket prices will increase but the average fan has already been priced out of football tickets at Clemson.
The next step will be the NASCAR example of half empty stadiums.
Clemson should make The Hill tickets a first come, first serve for a reasonable price, maybe $25-30 each. The hill attendance will be solved.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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Do you have more evidence?
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Mar 20, 2024, 9:26 AM
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IMO that only proves that Michigan's ticket prices are higher than Clemson's.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: I know some Maryland fans and none of them
Mar 20, 2024, 9:47 AM
[ in reply to Re: I know some Maryland fans and none of them ] |
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Lowest average price at Clemson is $79, Michigan $93
Average cost of tickets Clemson $438, Michigan $548. So yes, ticket prices will increase but the average fan has already been priced out of football tickets at Clemson.
The next step will be the NASCAR example of half empty stadiums.
Clemson should make The Hill tickets a first come, first serve for a reasonable price, maybe $25-30 each. The hill attendance will be solved.
Now I do like that option
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Athletic Dir [890]
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Re: I know some Maryland fans and none of them
Mar 20, 2024, 3:15 PM
[ in reply to Re: I know some Maryland fans and none of them ] |
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Why would tickets be more expensive from being in a different conference unless you got to see a better game? Maybe they could lower ticket prices for wofford type games.
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110%er [5512]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:20 AM
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The money disparity in a few years will be absolutely massive. We are talking several tens of millions of dollars per year. Yes, it will easily cover increased travel costs.
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Legend [17918]
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Progress is like a lawnmower...
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:20 AM
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It is pushed where the grass needs cutting. And everybody likes a smooth, "sharp dressed" lawn after it is cut. But no one, that I know of, looks back as says, "I wish I had just let that grass grow." Nope, they always look back over the lawn after it is cut, and says, "Wow, that looks nice."
...even if the shorter grass reveals some bald spots it will still be cut.
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All-In [25393]
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We may have to yield here and there, but imagine
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:22 AM
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Clemson playing the likes of Bama, LSU, Texas, Tennessee, UGA and others every year.
To this day I'll watch SEC football games in a second over most ACC games...always have, always will, as I'm more familiar with those states and schools, have relatives and friends in most of those states affiliated with those programs.
I know there are other sports involved, but Clemson/Syracuse events will never have the draw, say, of Clemson/Oklahoma ones...or Clemson/Auburn. I say all this because I think we have already had our taljs with the SEC.
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Oculus Spirit [96873]
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Of course you'll watch SEC football games in a second over most ACC games...
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Mar 20, 2024, 9:06 AM
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coot
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All-American [560]
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Seriously is that all got?..
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:24 AM
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The meeting at the paw and a disjointed cautionary tale about Maryland's departure. Make something up next time–
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Seriously is that all got?..
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Mar 20, 2024, 9:49 AM
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The meeting at the paw and a disjointed cautionary tale about Maryland's departure. Make something up next time–
I mean gathering at the paw coot is a tradition that fans, kids everyone loves. Kiss it bye bc if you know ball then you’d known those conferences don’t allow. You get a hefty fine each time you do
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CU Guru [1432]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:32 AM
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Maybe you should drink another pot of coffee before you share your morning musing.
Not sure if you are really paying attention if you think Maryland is regretting their move.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 9:50 AM
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Maybe you should drink another pot of coffee before you share your morning musing.
Not sure if you are really paying attention if you think Maryland is regretting their move.
Not a coffee drinker carry on
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CU Guru [1432]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 11:00 AM
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explains why your gears were turning slow this morning
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Orange Blooded [3730]
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I so sick of listening to all of this - I want it OVER and DONE with
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:33 AM
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…Please…the torture of all of this uncertainty is driving me crazy.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: I so sick of listening to all of this - I want it OVER and DONE with
Mar 20, 2024, 9:51 AM
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…Please…the torture of all of this uncertainty is driving me crazy.
Then don’t click and don’t read
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CU Guru [1047]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:43 AM
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The typical local fan has already been barred from the game by the extreme cost. We won’t lose anything. Only the wealthy can travel with the team within the acc so we don’t lose anything there. We who get espn will still get to watch every game, and the rest of us have the same 105.5. Why worry about the flight to Michigan?
As we draw nearer and nearer the kill point where professionalism kills college sports, I figure they’re going to go for the money anyway so I’m just along for the ride till my heart is no longer in it.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 9:52 AM
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The typical local fan has already been barred from the game by the extreme cost. We won’t lose anything. Only the wealthy can travel with the team within the acc so we don’t lose anything there. We who get espn will still get to watch every game, and the rest of us have the same 105.5. Why worry about the flight to Michigan?
As we draw nearer and nearer the kill point where professionalism kills college sports, I figure they’re going to go for the money anyway so I’m just along for the ride till my heart is no longer in it.
It’s close for me of me and many not caring like we did. Unfortunate
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CU Guru [1390]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:45 AM
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lol so your thought process is to stick head in sand and shoot for irrelevance
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 9:53 AM
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lol so your thought process is to stick head in sand and shoot for irrelevance
Aren’t we trending down from these past few football seasons? It’s gonna get easier? I mean we won’t know until we make the jump but …
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All-In [30839]
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Clemson feels like this is the best move for
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Mar 20, 2024, 8:52 AM
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Them..
So we watch.. and wait.... which is really what fans do.
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Team Captain [455]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 9:23 AM
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25 to 30 million more a year sounds greener to me. Clemson will be a top team in the Big 10 right off the bat
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All-In [31315]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 10:42 AM
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I also think Clemson recruits top 10 on a consistent basis not being in the ACC. Could be wrong but we are pretty darn close to that now being in the ACC.
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110%er [8538]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 9:40 AM
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Season tickets for football cannot go much higher because they sell out every year. All money goes to the Athletic Department where the bills for the entire program are paid so the called Olympic sports are not in danger, especially soccer.
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110%er [6474]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 9:55 AM
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I quit going to the pawn to gather 10 yrs ago. I honestly don't care if it gets banned. We named "gathering at the paw" and made it sacred or something. All schools did it at some time. They moved on. We will have to also.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 10:01 AM
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It all went down when the balloons got banned and people started wooing during tiger rag
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CU Guru [1020]
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Agreed.
Mar 20, 2024, 12:48 PM
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That "woo" is too much like what the Tennessee fans do during Rocky Top.
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1st Rounder [611]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 10:01 AM
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Maryland is laughing all the way to the bank, count on it.
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Orange Blooded [3965]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 10:38 AM
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People referring back to when Maryland, TA&M, Nebraska, etc made the move as a reason we shouldn’t switch conferences don’t get it. Eventually anyone outside of the power two will be in the outside looking in. The SEC and the B1G are about to create the two mega conferences (as Dabo has mentioned) and they will control major CFB.
If we stayed in the ACC we eventually wouldn’t even have a seat at the table. We’d be considered like the group of 5 conferences. Recruits wouldn’t dare come play for us over a power 2 team. Either join the power two or get left behind.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 11:18 AM
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We might get left behind but we also might not because of our brand as a whole and what dabo has built. Take that in consideration. Just like we had dark days with baseball recently. Guess what a stories program doesn’t live in the dark long usually because of the past and the culture
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Orange Blooded [3213]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 11:26 AM
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There is no might not. What Dabo has built cannot and will not be sustainable due to the huge pay differences. Add to that Clemson being relegated to second tier status and we're back to 2 and 3 star players instead of 4 and 5 star players.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 11:47 AM
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We’re acting like we are struggling on and off the field
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 11:48 AM
[ in reply to Re: Grass aint always greener ] |
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There is no might not. What Dabo has built cannot and will not be sustainable due to the huge pay differences. Add to that Clemson being relegated to second tier status and we're back to 2 and 3 star players instead of 4 and 5 star players.
Weren’t we getting two and three stars back before dabo built what he has built…
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Orange Blooded [3213]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 12:20 PM
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Yeah...that's why I said back to.
Face facts, the B1G and SEC are running college football along with their TV partners. To remain one of the upper tier teams/programs changes have to be made. If you are trying to keep up with the Joneses and you're making half as much money you will only be able to do so much.
The CFP payout has been renegotiated and the ACC team distribution is 8 million less than the SEC and B1G. Revenue from TV contracts are 30-50 million a year larger for those conferences versus the ACC. At a minimum Clemson will be making 38 million dollars a year less than Vanderbilt. Let that sink in.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 2:01 PM
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Yeah...that's why I said back to.
Face facts, the B1G and SEC are running college football along with their TV partners. To remain one of the upper tier teams/programs changes have to be made. If you are trying to keep up with the Joneses and you're making half as much money you will only be able to do so much.
The CFP payout has been renegotiated and the ACC team distribution is 8 million less than the SEC and B1G. Revenue from TV contracts are 30-50 million a year larger for those conferences versus the ACC. At a minimum Clemson will be making 38 million dollars a year less than Vanderbilt. Let that sink in.
We make up in other areas. Vanderbilt might have more donors and such but athletic dept as a whole comparing to Clemson even facilities isn’t close.
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110%er [6474]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 12:42 PM
[ in reply to Re: Grass aint always greener ] |
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TAKE off your orange glasses and come to reality.
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CU Guru [1045]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 12:36 PM
[ in reply to Re: Grass aint always greener ] |
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This is the one part that's not 100% accurate. If the ACC keeps all the teams it has now, it won't be considered a G5 conference. The revenue gap would certainly be an issue, but Clemson eoild still have a chance to be a national championship program.
Now, if Florida St.and some other teams figure out a way to leave and Clemson gets left behind, then yeah, that's big trouble.
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Orange Blooded [4069]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 12:15 PM
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Clemson and Maryland are not comparable. Not even close.
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CU Guru [1087]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 12:16 PM
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I hate the coots so much that to me the reward lies in creating an even greater advantage over them than we already enjoy.
Stop to think what eliminating the only advantage they have over us by being in the SEC would mean to our rivalry.
We are doing pretty well right now as it is but making that leap would squash all the talk about Clemson struggling to land recruits..
In fact, I can envision a scenario where what Dabo has created in Clemson will travel well into either conference, no matter where we land. We could very well become the top destination in the country
That's not as far fetched as it sounds.
Consider our struggle to recruit quality OL until our recent success.
Going to the B1G would open the most fertile grounds for OL recruits in the country.
Don't take my word for it. Go look at the starting lineups of OL in the NFL.
They are loaded down with B1G recruits
As for as Maryland is concerned they've never committed much to college football outside of producing numerous NFL QBs.
When I think of MD that's what I think of.
And as Dabo says " the best is yet to come "
Boy you ain't kidding. Go Tigers
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110%er [6474]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 2:28 PM
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We are not in as "high demand" as some of y'all think. SEC does not need us. We bring them very little new money. We would bring some TV money to the BIG, but we don't have the "other sports" they require.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
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Mar 20, 2024, 12:23 PM
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Counter argument:
Maybe with an extra $60+ million a year coming in, Clemson won't have to bleed its fans dry on ticket/IPTAY costs just to keep up.
If you want to keep winning national while remaining in the ACC, then you can count on Clemson fans having to foot the bill.
Now, there is no guarantee that Clemson won't raise prices if it leaves, but you can count on it 100% having to raise prices to keep up if it stays put.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 1:59 PM
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Iptay prices will increase never will they decrease…money hungry and money driven. It will be all high donors and corporations before it’s over or soon
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Rock Defender [54]
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Grass ain't NEVER greener.
Mar 20, 2024, 12:31 PM
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I was born into money, and my wife was born into money, and now we have a lot of money, and I can say without a doubt that all a lot of money does is distort reality.
Because scriptures are right: loving money is a fatal disease for people.
But the ACC isn't a person it's a business, and Clemson is a business, too. And they've got to protect their interests.
No doubt the Clemson football experience for the average dude/fan will become less personal, more corporate as a result of the business-side of things.
That's certainly what's happened for us at the University of Texas. If you have to ask how much, you can't afford it anymore unless you want to sit at the top rim of a stadium that itself is a monument to an unhealthy love of college football.
It's also happening at Clemson, it's just more of a creeping sort of corporatization of the thing - more subtle. But the money my family shovels into CU athletics is beyond anything any of them envisioned 25 years ago and only getting bigger, and the school is not afraid to ask for more, all the time.
Because someone has to write the checks. Someone has to build the facilities and pay the NIL salaries and coach's salaries.
So Clemson's looking for TV to do that. And maybe they'll figure it out. But don't think for a second you're not about to get priced out of it. You probably are.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: Grass ain't NEVER greener.
Mar 20, 2024, 1:04 PM
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I have no argument with anything you said.
No school who wants to compete on the national level is above the cencept of corporatization.
My counterpoint is that your statements are a completely different argument and are not connected to changing conferences.
No matter how much money schools make, they will still request/beg for donations.
Clemson is going to ask for money from the fans whether it stays or goes from the ACC.
If that's the case, then we should want Clemson to make as much as possible from other avenues so it doesn't have to completely rely on the fans to foot the bill to keep up.
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Rock Defender [54]
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That's a great point and well-taken.
Mar 20, 2024, 3:26 PM
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass ain't NEVER greener.
Mar 20, 2024, 2:04 PM
[ in reply to Grass ain't NEVER greener. ] |
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I was born into money, and my wife was born into money, and now we have a lot of money, and I can say without a doubt that all a lot of money does is distort reality.
Because scriptures are right: loving money is a fatal disease for people.
But the ACC isn't a person it's a business, and Clemson is a business, too. And they've got to protect their interests.
No doubt the Clemson football experience for the average dude/fan will become less personal, more corporate as a result of the business-side of things.
That's certainly what's happened for us at the University of Texas. If you have to ask how much, you can't afford it anymore unless you want to sit at the top rim of a stadium that itself is a monument to an unhealthy love of college football.
It's also happening at Clemson, it's just more of a creeping sort of corporatization of the thing - more subtle. But the money my family shovels into CU athletics is beyond anything any of them envisioned 25 years ago and only getting bigger, and the school is not afraid to ask for more, all the time.
Because someone has to write the checks. Someone has to build the facilities and pay the NIL salaries and coach's salaries.
So Clemson's looking for TV to do that. And maybe they'll figure it out. But don't think for a second you're not about to get priced out of it. You probably are.
No doubt. Prices will only go up. You’d think maybe acc would might want to add more and protect members while adding more and renegotiate tv deals etc.
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All-In [44054]
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Maryland made an outstanding decision.
Mar 20, 2024, 12:42 PM
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I was sad to see them leave the ACC, and thought it was odd at the time. But looking back, their decision was a great one.
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Rock Defender [54]
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What makes you say that?
Mar 20, 2024, 1:00 PM
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I could find myself feeling as though Maryland has prospered in the new conference, but, I don't have anything substantive to back up that feeling.
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Re: What makes you say that?
1
Mar 20, 2024, 1:07 PM
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Had Maryland stayed in the ACC they would have had major athletic cuts at this point.
They severely mismanaged funds within the athletic department and had to fire an AD who created their problems.
Being in the BIG kept them afloat until they could get things back in order.
For the most part their on-field product is no better or worse, but financially they are much better off.
Oddly enough, their baseball program is probably on better ground than it was in the ACC because it no longer has to battle southern schools to compete.
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CU Guru [1045]
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Re: Maryland made an outstanding decision.
Mar 20, 2024, 2:34 PM
[ in reply to Maryland made an outstanding decision. ] |
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Let's be accurate though. Marykand backed into an outstanding decision, because their athletic department was bleeding money and they had to do something to stay afloat. They they didn't have foresight is the where that would lead to today.
It's kind of like how South Carolina backed into getting into the SEC, after they made the asinine decision to go independent in the seventies and Florida State decided not to join the SEC in the 90s.
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MVP [525]
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But more money is greener
Mar 20, 2024, 1:09 PM
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By definition....
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: But more money is greener
Mar 20, 2024, 2:05 PM
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By definition....
Money isn’t everything but to many it’s the only thing and the clemson family or we care is on its way out the door. It’s the privileged now days
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110%er [6964]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
1
Mar 20, 2024, 2:32 PM
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What do you mean ask Maryland how it turned out? It's not like they were killing it in the ACC so now they are basically middle of the pack with way more money and conference security
That's a heck of an upgrade if you ask me
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Varsity [236]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 3:08 PM
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Your "Gathering at the Paw" is a great tradition and would NOT be banned in the SEC. The SEC policy aims to prevent fans storming the field uncontrollably, but specifically allows teams to let fans on the field once the visiting team and referees have left the field. The times I've been on the Paw, it was a few minutes after the game ended and it was pretty orderly. Unless things have changed there, that would be completely allowed under SEC policy.
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 3:51 PM
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Your "Gathering at the Paw" is a great tradition and would NOT be banned in the SEC. The SEC policy aims to prevent fans storming the field uncontrollably, but specifically allows teams to let fans on the field once the visiting team and referees have left the field. The times I've been on the Paw, it was a few minutes after the game ended and it was pretty orderly. Unless things have changed there, that would be completely allowed under SEC policy.
don’t y’all get fined….they said years ago and they have. “Policy” taken lightly. To wait a few min. Think students or elderly security takes that serious or fans…no they go on the field when clock hits zero. There isn’t any waiting
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Asst Coach [722]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 20, 2024, 3:52 PM
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A source just told me Mr neff said it’s official just waiting on settlement then it’s coming…likely to BIG
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110%er [6474]
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Orange Blooded [4069]
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GRASS IS DEFINTLEY GREENER IN THIS CASE.....
Mar 20, 2024, 4:16 PM
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Why take a common saying and apply it to a situation where it doesn't apply.
LISTEN TO YOUR COACH
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Starter [390]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 23, 2024, 10:37 AM
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Th grass might not be greener but the $$$$ are
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CU Guru [1932]
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Re: Grass aint always greener
Mar 23, 2024, 12:08 PM
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I'm not certain the ACC is done yet. I think there may be a model if we get a redo on the TV contract and revenue sharing that reflects value that might save the Conference. The suits may just be an attempt to drive ACC and ESPN in the direction of a compromise.
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